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In Atlanta, a two-faced NOM: songs of unity while trashing same-sex families

NOM Tour Tracker Right-wing

By Arisha Michelle Hatch

We arrived here in Atlanta curious about what direction NOM would go today. Our arrival came on the heels of NOM refusing to allow us or openly affectionate same-sex couples into their rally in St. Louis, MO– having the police act as bouncers forced to make value judgments about the “right kind of people” to be allowed in.

While today’s event may go differently, the outpouring of support from the pro-equality community is no different. We’re standing in a crowd of 254 equality supporters standing alongside a church across the street from the State Capitol.

Equality supporters in Atlanta getting ready to march to the statehouse

Mobilized by Equality Georgia, more than organizers held a rally at Woodruff Park at 12:30 before marching down to the Capitol. They stand silently holding signs.

We see that Dr. Alveda King has made it. She’s joined by only about 16 NOM supporters (Louis would call it 20 but we’re not counting you, Brian, Justin, Mike, the videographer, or the speakers).

Dr. Alveda King in Atlanta GA

NOM supporters in Atlanta GA

There are about 5 other press outlets present.

We’re listening to a gospel singer sing a song called “Unity” by Vernessa Mitchell, who Brian Brown said performed at Clinton’s inauguration (one of the inaugural balls, it turns out).

It’s a beautiful rendition. The equality protesters are dancing and cheering, while NOM supporters are standing stoically.

“Unity that’s what we need…we need to show more love to one another,” the singer rifts.

Wow. That’s a new kind of messaging.

But the rest of the event has, so far, turned out to be the same old NOM.

Dr. King made a few short remarks.

“I don’t know about you but I’m not ready to be extinct,” King said to the crowd after pointing out that “it is statistically proven” that marriage between one man and one woman is the foundation of society.

Some would say that there are many more [equality] protestors here than [NOM] supporters,” Brian Brown said. “But what [about] the 70 percent of voters?” who banned same-sex marriage in Georgia.

“Children without a mom and a dad are 20 times more likely to commit a crime,” said Tonya Ditty, Georgia State Director of Concerned Women for America.

Ah, there’s the NOM we all know.

UPDATE BY ADAM (12:12 PST): Here are photos from the Equality Georgia rally and march:

Equality supporters in Atlanta GA marching to the statehouse

Couple in Atlanta GA

Couple with great signs in Atlanta, GA

George Equality supporters

UPDATE BY ADAM (1:48 PST): Anthony just radioed in- we’ll have video of Alveda King, along with Arisha’s comments, coming in soon.

UPDATE BY ADAM (1:55 PST): I want to highlight a comment from Courage’s Rick Jacobs in the comments:

I wonder if NOM and Co. understand that Chief Justice Roberts is the father of two adopted children. Does that mean that his children are not being raised properly because they were not raised by their “natural” parents?

Does NOM and Co. really mean that the tens of millions of children of divorced parents are 20 times more likely to commit crimes than those of the parents who stayed together?

They seem constantly to forget that this is about family. Family has changed in America, as Dr. Cott pointed out in the trial.

NOM is insulting not only same-sex families, but single-parent families as well, here. In Ditty’s world (and evidently NOM’s world, too), apparently only a 2.5 child nuclear family with a mom, a dad, a dog and a picket fence is the ideal. That’s disrespectful.

UPDATE BY ARISHA (1:59 PST): My streak of remaining disengaged as an interviewer was broken today in front of the Capitol building in Atlanta.  I’ve interviewed Larry Adams, a NOM rally attendee, that suggested that the solution to homosexuality was lynching; I’ve interviewed a Pentecostal minister, speaking in tongues in Providence; I’ve endured Brian Brown’s spin without flinching.

But today was different.

Five minutes into my interview with Dr. Alveda King (video coming), I began to cry.  I was talking about the privileges that I, as a 28 year old African American woman, have received – the privilege of going to integrated schools, never feeling as if my race or my gender were barriers to my success – when I felt my voice begin to break, my body quiver, and my eyes well up with tears.

I don’t know why.  I can’t explain it.

She reached her hand out to me, offering something cliche like “you are beautiful.”

“Hold it together, Arisha,” I thought to myself.

Perhaps I was too excited about this interview.  Maybe, just maybe, the anticipation of it all got the best of me.  Or perhaps, I was sad to see this woman – and the King name – being used as a prop for NOM.  Perhaps I expected Dr. Alveda King to actually answer my questions.

Maybe I expected too much from her.

Nonetheless, standing in front of the Capitol steps – interviewing the niece of a hero – and all I could do was cry.

UPDATE BY ADAM (2:38 PST): Here’s the video. It’s incredible.


  • 1. Ķĭŗîļĺę&  |  August 7, 2010 at 5:12 am

    There is only one true thing about BS Brown: BS (bulls' shit) is actually brown!

  • 2. Ronnie  |  August 7, 2010 at 5:20 am

    “I don’t know about you but I’m not ready to be extinct,” King said to the crowd after pointing out that “it is statistically proven” that marriage between one man and one woman is the foundation of society."

    Ummmm….& she's a Dr.?…..A Dr. of what?….idiocracy?….. : I …..Ronnie

  • 3. AndrewPDX  |  August 7, 2010 at 5:22 am

    I'm sure Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. is sickened over how his own flesh and blood would betray his ideals like this.

    Don't worry, Dr. King! We won't forget you like your niece has!


  • 4. Anonygrl  |  August 7, 2010 at 5:22 am

    Hooray! Good for you Georgia! And Georgia Equality! You are doing us proud! Thanks for being there and continuing to show the world that it is all about love!!!

    Love you guys!

  • 5. Alan E.  |  August 7, 2010 at 5:23 am

    Bring it on! (the email onslaught)

  • 6. AndrewPDX  |  August 7, 2010 at 5:24 am

    They say there are three types of lies:

    Lies, Damned Lies, and Statistics.

    NOM is good at all three types of lies.

    Does NOM stand for "National Organization for Misinformation"?


  • 7. Kathleen  |  August 7, 2010 at 5:25 am

    BEAUTIFUL pictures of EQUALITY.

    If it's true that 70% of the voters were willing to cast an anonymous vote agreeing with NOM's message, then the low turnout seems to be a result of the reluctance of these voters to show up in public. NOM might want to consider offering to mail the sheets and hoods to people's houses ahead of time to address this concern.

  • 8. Ronnie  |  August 7, 2010 at 5:28 am

    That would be a resounding FRACK YEAH THEY DO!!!!… ; )

  • 9. DazedWheels  |  August 7, 2010 at 5:29 am

    "The time is always right to do what is right."
    The Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.

    Subscribing, too. :-)

  • 10. Bolt  |  August 7, 2010 at 5:30 am

    Very cool pictures. So inspiring.

    Off topic, but I'll guess V. Walker will lift his stay, and we can resume the practice of marriage equality in California. There doesn't seem to be any reason not to!

    Have a wonderful weekend, everyone!

  • 11. Michelle Evans  |  August 7, 2010 at 5:30 am

    Yes, one of my all-time favorite quotes. It was originally penned by the great American writer and humorist, Mark Twain.

  • 12. adambink  |  August 7, 2010 at 5:30 am

    Weirdly, I was thinking about that quip for a post title!

  • 13. Anonygrl  |  August 7, 2010 at 5:31 am

    She holds an honorary doctorate from Saint Anselm College, a benedictine Catholic liberal arts college.

    So she is basically a doctor of nothing, and most people with this sort of honorary degree do not call themselves doctor.

    She has an MA in business, and is an anti-choice activist, despite having had two abortions herself. As a matter of fact, abortion, not marriage, is her big issue.

    She appears to be quite the opportunist, playing on her father and more famous uncle for attention, and hopping on bandwagons frequently.

    It is good to see that only 16 people in Atlanta bothered to go listen to her drivel.

  • 14. Lightning Baltimore  |  August 7, 2010 at 5:33 am

    I was planning on going today, but the intense heat and obligations at home kept me here.


  • 15. Anonygrl  |  August 7, 2010 at 5:35 am

    Aww… going to come out in DC?

  • 16. Lightning Baltimore  |  August 7, 2010 at 5:38 am

    Do we know each other? I live in the Altanta area but my folks live in the DC area. Freaky, man!

  • 17. Sagesse  |  August 7, 2010 at 5:39 am

    Signing the petition. Please talk to me.

  • 18. Raymond Fernandez  |  August 7, 2010 at 5:41 am

    Yes statistically most children do come from heterosexual sex. Also most statistics prove that most ppl do eat and that keeps them alive. Statistics show that men have penises too. Thank You Dr.OBVIOUS

  • 19. Ann S.  |  August 7, 2010 at 5:42 am

    More mail, please. NOM NOM NOM NOM

  • 20. Sarah  |  August 7, 2010 at 5:44 am

    It is our fault, you know. The problem is that all those gay people scare them; don't forget, rainbows are scary and intimidating things! There's probably a pitchfork or two hidden behind all those equals signs, too. Two men together for 35 years?? Why hasn't God struck them down? I know I wouldn't want to be around to watch that.

  • 21. couragecampaign  |  August 7, 2010 at 5:45 am

    I wonder if NOM and Co. understand that Chief Justice Roberts is the father of two adopted children. Does that mean that his children are not being raised properly because they were not raised by their "natural" parents?

    Does NOM and Co. really mean that the tens of millions of children of divorced parents are 20 times more likely to commit crimes than those of the parents who stayed together?

    They seem constantly to forget that this is about family. Family has changed in America, as Dr. Cott pointed out in the trial.

    I wonder what statistics they'll cite next?


  • 22. Marlene  |  August 7, 2010 at 5:47 am

    Ah, yes… the same tired rhetoric, Ms King? The *same* rhetoric of "extinction" racists used to justify denying *interracial* couples from marrying?

    Her "honorary" doctorate should be revoked!

  • 23. Ronnie  |  August 7, 2010 at 5:47 am

    Hey Trackers, Let's welcome Ray, one of the courageous admins who started Freedom Fighters for Equality on Facebook….this is his first comment on Tracker.


  • 24. Sarah  |  August 7, 2010 at 5:50 am

    Don't you think that if we make "gay marriage" a protected right, everybody will want one? 😉 Forget the fact that we actually want our MARRIAGE rights enforced, the simple adjective in front causes such a disservice to our equality fight. We are not trying to make gay marriage a right, we are fighting for marriage, plain and simple!

  • 25. Ann S.  |  August 7, 2010 at 5:57 am

    Welcome, Ray!

  • 26. Straight Grandmother  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:00 am

    When we say that NOM is attactins Tens of people, how do we refer to the Atlanta ? They didn't make it to 20 people making 10 (2 x 10 =20) plural, but it was more than ten. What is the appropriate term? How about, "NOM attacted 10+ supporters" Does that sound about right?

  • 27. ElsieH  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:00 am

    Hi Ray! Welcome!

  • 28. Anna Bryan  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:01 am

    I'm really starting to feel bad for them. It's really embarrassing, and Brian and Mags may lose their jobs over this…

  • 29. Straight Grandmother  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:02 am

    Bring it ON Ray!!! So pleased you dropped by.

  • 30. Steve  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:03 am

    But, it's obvious. People who marry someone of the same gender don't start families and don't breed. And if more people have same-sex marriages, more people will choose to become gay. Birth rates will decline and we will die out.

  • 31. Mark M  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:05 am

    Welcome to the P8TT Family Ray!

  • 32. Lightning Baltimore  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:05 am

    How about, "slightly more than a baker's dozen?"

  • 33. Mark M  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:06 am


  • 34. Mark M  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:07 am

    Hell yes it does!!

  • 35. Anonygrl  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:07 am

    Oh, I don't think we know each other… and I am currently in Albany, NY…

    I was asking if you were coming to DC because of the Baltimore in your name. And I just didn't want you to miss all the fun!

    Shows what I get for assuming things, I suppose. :)

  • 36. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:08 am

    The only reason they invited Dr. Alveda King is to try and bolster their claim that the NOMbies represent "the next great civil rights movement." Since this is Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.'s niece, they think they will be able to reinforce that false image of themselves. I would love to hear her response to her Aunt Coretta Scott King's declaration that the LGBTQQI community should also be seated at the table of Equality and Freedom.

  • 37. Lightning Baltimore  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:09 am

    I've actually read the claim from some religious conservate that, once men experience sex with other men, they will forgo sex with women.

  • 38. Lightning Baltimore  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:11 am

    Ah . . . Lightning Baltimore is my drag queen name, via the first pet + street where you grew up equation.


    I don't actually do drag, but I love the name!

  • 39. Ann S.  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:11 am

    Hey guys — I just came across this radio interview with my brother Stuart and his husband John — Stuart talks about our parents' marriage, which was, at the time, illegal in a number of states:

  • 40. Ronnie  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:11 am

    No, because that's what surrogacy is for….JMHGO….but there will still be heterosexuals making babies & procreating (do a shot)…..<3…Ronnie

  • 41. Anna Bryan  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:12 am

    I think Alveda King's response is that the table of bigotry and prejudice pays more.

  • 42. Ann S.  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:13 am

    It's about 7 minutes and, IMHO, well worth a listen.

  • 43. Straight Grandmother  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:13 am

    Can we get that #FAIL NOM headline back again? If there was ever an instance where it applied I think it is Atlanta. I mean 16 people? And no doubt Alveda King brought a couple peeps with her so how many are *really* there for the cause, 12?

  • 44. Straight Grandmother  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:15 am

    LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Very observant. I bet she could get a job with David Blankenhorn's outfit.

  • 45. Ray in MA  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:17 am

    A Q for Lyin' Brian…

    Why is that you bother to continue this tour with such an extremely low turnout at each stop?

    (I like to keep q's short and simple… with little time to think of a reply … I mean LIE.)

    I came across a great post the other day (can't recall where):

    "Why do gay people hate us so much and call us bigots?
    We can't help it! We were born this way!!!"

    Go get'em Atlanta!

  • 46. Steve  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:18 am

    I was being sarcastic in case you hadn't noticed :p

    @Lightning Baltimore
    No doubt speaking from personal experience

  • 47. Anonygrl  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:20 am

    How about they attracted "ones of people"? Would you buy "NOM crowd numbered in the mid to high teens!!" "German papers report NOM rally attended by 'sechzehn volk'!" (well, ok, Germany doesn't care… )

    Wait, I got it! "More people made it to NOM's rally today than there are on the whole 56 million square miles of Mars combined!!"

  • 48. Raymond Fernandez  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:20 am

    Thanks for the warm welcomes everyone. I've been watching for a while. You have no idea how pissed off the fundies get when i post the daily numbers from their rallies. Thanks to the Trackers.

    It's nice to meet all of you =-)


  • 49. Lightning Baltimore  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:21 am

    Well, having attempted the straight route before finally accepting myself, I can certainly agree that m/m sex is considerably more satisfying, both emotionally and physically, than m/f . . . for me, that is. ^_^

  • 50. Ronnie  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:23 am

    @Steve… I noticed (with a little bit snark thrown in there too….nicely played)…. ; )

  • 51. Ray in MA  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:27 am

    That was ABOSULUTELY an incredible thing for them to do.

    Really, they have guts and passion!

    …but I think they absolutely love the word "absolutely" … a bit of constructive criticism :)

  • 52. Ray in MA  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:29 am

    And yet another possible reason… she probably paid $$$.

  • 53. Ronnie  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:30 am

    In honor of NOM's FAIL in Atlanta, Georgia…

    "Georgia, Georgia, The whole day through. Just an old sweet song. Keeps Georgia on my mind

    I'm say Georgia. Georgia. A song of you, Comes as sweet and clear. As moonlight through the pines

    Other arms reach out to me. Other eyes smile tenderly. Still in peaceful dreams I see, The road leads back to you

    I said Georgia, Ooh Georgia, no peace I find. Just an old sweet song, Keeps Georgia on my mind

    Other arms reach out to me. Other eyes smile tenderly. Still in peaceful dreams I see, The road leads back to you

    Georgia, Georgia, No peace, no peace I find. Just this old, sweet song….Keeps Georgia on my mind

    I said just an old sweet song, Keeps Georgia on my mind"


  • 54. Skemono  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:31 am

    “I don’t know about you but I’m not ready to be extinct,” King said to the crowd

    Which isn't going to happen any time soon, so what's your point? Do you really think that straight people are going to stop having sex or children if gay people get married? That's inane.

    Oh, and let's compare that imbecility with what Josiah Clark Nott had to say about miscegenation:

    I believe that if a hundred Anglo-Saxon men, and one hundred Negro women, were put together on an island, and cut off from all intercourse with the rest of world, they would in time become extinct.

    The stupidity continues with,

    “Children without a mom and a dad are 20 times more likely to commit a crime,” said Tonya Ditty, Georgia State Director of Concerned Women for America.

    Comparing single parents to same-sex parents is comparing apples and oranges. Children raised by same-sex couples turn out no different from those raised by opposite-sex couples. Stop it with the fucking lies.

  • 55. Ann S.  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:31 am

    @Ray, thanks, and absolutely they have guts and passion!


  • 56. Anonygrl  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:32 am

    LOL I love it! I had forgotten that game!

    Mine is Kissy Tillson. Which is kind of a good porn name, actually.

  • 57. Anonygrl  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:33 am

    And a very sweet interview! Thanks for sharing it!

  • 58. Ann S.  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:37 am

    Thanks, everyone!

  • 59. jc  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:38 am

    hmmm a 'replie'? sounds about right!

  • 60. Ann S.  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:40 am

    Good comment from the ABA Journal article I linked a while back —

    "If we’re willing to indulge in the fiction that Scalia is impartial when ruling on an issue that is dictated by his Catholic faith, why are we not willing to extend a similar “objective until proven otherwise” presumption to Walker?"

  • 61. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:41 am

    If that is the way it was done, then I did it all wrong. If it is determined that way, then mine should have been Tilly Abney.

  • 62. Bob  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:44 am

    Sarah, little baby Roy, wonders, what happened to his right to life, that's supposedly a prized thing protected under the constitution, he wasn't even thinking about the marriage thing.
    he just wanted to live and be safe

    but guess the explained the brute that took his , probably didn't have a mom and a dad. that's why he murdered him.

  • 63. Kathleen  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:44 am

    Welcome, Ray!!! So glad you've decided to post. Our wonderfully diverse rainbow family at P8TT keeps growing.

    @Sarah, I agree on the language (I think we've discussed this here before). I prefer talking about 'marriage equality' and if I need to distinguish because of context, I refer to ss couples or os couples. I'm of the opinion that language is powerful and definitely influences the debate. Case in point, notice that NOM et al rarely refer to gays and lesbians or glbt people, instead it's usually 'homosexuals' (and no mention whatsoever of transgender people).

  • 64. Joel  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:46 am

    NOM is rapidly becoming the new KLK. The reason they have restricted their "rallies" to "only the right king of people" is because they recognize among themselves that they are not preaching a message of love and acceptance, but one of hate and exclusion, and their fear that their basic message will not be accepted ny mainstream America.
    If your message is so important, Ms. Gallagher and Mr. Brown, and you believe in it so fervently, why are you steeping that message in secrecy? Why are you not willing to engage in a public and civil debate? People who are right welcome the chance. It is only people that are wrong, and know it, who try to hide their identities and flee from public discourse.

  • 65. adambink  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:46 am

    Hey everyone, we have video of Alveda King coming in soon.

  • 66. Joel  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:50 am

    I get the prize for worst drag/porn name! Dodo Barkerville!

    I had a friend who did drag. He impersonated all the CW ladies and his drag name was Iona…

    Wait for it…

    Iona Traylor

  • 67. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:50 am

    Thank you for sharing this with us, Ann. Your parents are wonderful people and so are you, Stuart, and John. Looking forward to meeting all of you.

  • 68. Ann S.  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:52 am

    @Richard, thanks! My parents (and my whole family, including our 16-yo daughter) support marriage equality.

  • 69. AndrewPDX  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:53 am

    Great… Mine sounds more like a porn name than drag queen… Joey Spartan.


  • 70. Joel  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:55 am

    OOPS, That would be KKK. if there's an org out there called KLK I sincerely apologize

  • 71. Straight Grandmother  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:55 am

    I enjoyed it as well. It was very interesting to hear about your parnts not being able to marry in all states in 1967 becuase of the laws on inter racial marriage. WOW! do do do do do (you know that music from the Twilight Zone) it seems so erie in light of the current issues on Marriage Equality.

  • 72. Straight Grandmother  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:57 am

    And thank GOD fro Dr Nancy Cot. She was practically our best witness. Look how often Judge Walker quoted her in his verdict. What a scholarly woman.

  • 73. adambink  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:58 am

    Hey everyone, a number of updates posted above.

  • 74. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 6:59 am

    Howdy, Ray! Welcome to P8TT, and thanks for the work on FB with FF4E! Nice to see my online families overlap like this!

  • 75. Kathleen  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:00 am

    Rex Mahoney.

  • 76. Susan R Barnes  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:01 am

    @Kathleen, Great idea! LOL, I about dropped my sandwich while reading your comment!

  • 77. Ann S.  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:02 am

    @SG, thanks. I was 10 years old in 1967, and had no idea at the time that my parents' marriage hadn't been legal in all states. At some point they told me that when we had lived in Missouri and they bought their first house, they consulted an attorney and were told that, no, their marriage wasn't legal, but "probably" no one would bother them about the house purchase and taking title as husband and wife.

    You see, my mother is Chinese and my father is Caucasian. In Virginia, according to the law struck down by Loving v. Virginia, marriage between a black and white was a felony and void, but marriage between a white and an Asian was "only" a misdemeanor and voidable by the state.

    Gobsmacked much? I was when I learned about it.

  • 78. Lightning Baltimore  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:04 am

    I think it's incredible that in one of the most populous metro areas they've hit, if the not the most, they've mustered just about their lowest turnout yet.

  • 79. mackenzie  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:04 am

    They can't even get a decent turnout in some of the most conservative parts of the country, and look what we can do! Goodbye NOM.

  • 80. Str8 AlEye Mikael  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:05 am

    The "The Gay Agenda" sign in the third rally photo may be my favorite sign ever. It's incredible how difficult this is for the average individual to understand. I'd never before made a connection between the fictional gay agenda and the fictional Elders of Zion that supremacist-types are always babbling on about, but now it's clear as day.

    Of course, the secret gay Jewish militia has already accomplished its sinister agenda: the complete hostile takeover of American musical theatre! ;P

  • 81. Ann S.  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:06 am

    @Arisha, we're all right here, behind you. Thank you for all you do. We <3 Arisha!

  • 82. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:06 am

    And you even found the only artist I can ever listen to singing this song–Mr. Ray himself! Thank you, Ronnie. You know Ray won not only Grammies but CMA awards for his 1962 album, "The Modern Genius of Country Music." This man could sing any genre he put his mind to, because he always chose songs that he could fell, other than when he wrote songs himself. I am so glad he made so many recordings.

  • 83. Susan R Barnes  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:06 am

    Butch Sierra would be mine. This is fun!

  • 84. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:09 am

    Now if we could just get NOM to "Hit the Road, Jack! And don't you come back no more, no more, no more!"

  • 85. Straight Grandmother  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:11 am

    Arisha, I'm reaching out to you and wrapping my arms around you. Yeah I see how the surroundings could flood your emotions, I can see it. Embrace it. You were thinking of Dr. Martin Luthor King juxposed with today's struggle. This just prooves what a deep feeling person yoy are.

  • 86. Jim  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:12 am

    Small enough turnout that NOM could have held its rally on the NOM bus. Maybe NOM would have even allowed NOM Tour Tracker to sit in the back of the bus.

  • 87. AndrewPDX  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:13 am

    Heh… I was gonna make the comment about a 'rep-lie' too… But when I read yours, at first I saw it as 'reptile' instead… Still seems to apply (app-lie?), somehow.


  • 88. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:15 am

    @ Joel. Are you from Raleigh, NC by any chance? I swear I have heard that name up here somewhere. If not at Flex, then Legends or CC's.

  • 89. Straight Grandmother  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:18 am

    Yes Joel you DO win the prize.
    For me it is
    Klondike Converse

  • 90. Alan E.  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:19 am

    I love my drag name:

    Claire Wildwood

  • 91. Straight Grandmother  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:22 am

    Great Post Ann S.

  • 92. Alan E.  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:23 am

    Ann, I met Stuart while waiting in line at the closing arguments. I didn't realize at first you were his sister until I looked at names on Facebook. Even then I thought it was coincidence (at first).

    Come to think of it, I met a lot of great people while standing in line. We almost thought we weren't going to make it in because the line was insanely long.

  • 93. Anonygrl  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:24 am

    Because, of course, when we do a moon shot, we only look where we are going once in the whole flight. Then we close our eyes for 100,000 miles and hope for the best!

    10 years is woefully inadequate to determine the impact of these social experimental unions on children

    And the logical conclusion to THAT thought is "so I guess we better wait till we have a lot more data before we shoot our big mouths off again!"

  • 94. Susan R Barnes  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:25 am

    Because most bigots don't possess an ounce of objectivity, are completely blinded by their prejudices, have no integrity and are incapable of thinking beyond their misguided fears and hate. Just my humble opinion…

  • 95. Ann S.  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:25 am

    Alan, that's great you got to meet Stuart. I've been collecting screenshots of him and John in the news over the last couple of days and forwarding them on — I've lost count of how many there have been. I'm glad you got to be there for the closing arguments — that would have been so awesome!!

  • 96. Lightning Baltimore  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:25 am

    Whoa . . . one man/one woman marriage now has been found to date back 50,000 years? Nearly 45,000 years prior to the invention of written language to record it?


  • 97. Brittney  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:27 am

    I am from alabama…my girlfriend and I drove for 2 hours to atlanta, found ourselves in the ghetto……..and were never able to find woodruff park. I was so dissappointed I almost cried. I'd been looking foward to this for two weeks.
    Meh, oh well. At least there was a good turnout.
    Maybe next time.

  • 98. Ann S.  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:28 am

    Yes, it's amazing what these (supposedly) highly educated folks will say, some of them. I'm working my way through those comments, there are many excellent arguments on our side, and a few "interesting" ones on the other side. I haven't tried to count up the numbers "pro" and "con" (not that it would prove anything anyway), but it's another interesting discussion.

  • 99. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:28 am

    And I could create a company to handle the orders. Of course, I would mail everyone their hoods and robes adorned with rainbow trim, or even tie-dye in the rainbow colors.
    I really should behave myself now shouldn't I? NOT!!!

  • 100. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:30 am

    Oh, that was back in the 20's and 30's when that happened. Flo Ziegfeld, Louie Mayer, and all that crowd. And the entertainment has just kept rolling ever since, hasn't it?

  • 101. Eden James  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:32 am

    Everyone, please refresh the thread and read Arisha's latest update.

    I'm crying right now, after reading it. And so is my wife Amy, as we drive to a wedding in San Luis Obispo, California.

    Arisha is an incredible woman. A rock. Reading her reaction to Alveda King breaks my heart.

    But it also reminds us of why we doing this work. And strenthens our resolve to continue this struggle until full equality is the law of this beautiful land, in the spirit of the dream expressed by Martin Luther King, Jr.

    Eden w/ the Courage Campaign Institute

  • 102. Eden James  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:34 am

    So sorry to hear that, Brittney! Maybe you can make it to the Tampa event?

  • 103. Straight Grandmother  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:34 am

    I swear the people giving these speeches certainly do not know any GLBT people. They way they describe the rainbow tribe; they are full of defects, not normal, have had childhood trauma that turned them gay etc. They surely are not talking about any GLBT eople I know. Son, professional works for the gvt, his hsuband Ops Director of the major Global Warming org in the states, daughter masters degree plus 2 bachlors degrees, teaches children with severe autism, her wife a physician. A family friend's son is a college student another friend a physician, and wait for it, he's a pediatrician, another friend an attorney, another acquaintence an accountant. All leading just typical American lives, not "gay" Aerican lives just regular 'ole lives. This crap about peanut butter and Toyotas and Moon shots, it is ridiculous isn't it? I Mean, come on.

  • 104. Kathleen  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:35 am

    Oh Brittney, I'm sooooo sorry this happened. I can imagine how disappointing it must be. Hope you'll consider sticking around here and bask in the support and love that this site offers.


  • 105. VRAlbany  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:37 am

    Good showing, Georgia! The Atlanta crowd looks like a great bunch of people and the pictures make me wish I was there!

  • 106. Rob  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:38 am

    Arisha, you feel what you feel. Tears are good. They shouldn't be feared.

    I know personally that I find the "King" name being used in this perversion worthy of tears and crying. How sad; how frustrating; how disgusting.

    Any relative of MLK Jr. should absolutely, positively know better.

    Maybe tonight, or some other day, Alveda King will reflect on your tears, and her stony heart will be moved.

  • 107. Alan E.  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:39 am


    While following the Prop 8 trial, I have come to the personal conclusion to not wipe away my tears. I have left many streaks remain on my face in very public areas. At the closing arguments, I don't know how someone couldn't cry tears of joy while watching Ted Olsen give his closing arguments rebuttal. I have teared up at the many things people have said about gay people, but I refuse to wipe those away, too. When I was leaving the Commonwealth Club talk with David Boies, I had the largest permagrin and obvious water lines streaming symmetrically. Don't be embarrassed by your emotions. If it is something that you believe in strongly, then there are times as a journalist where it will be impossible to hold it back.

    I can't wait to see the video, and darnit if I won't hold back my tears.

  • 108. rf  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:39 am

    "do not know any GLBT people" that they know of or who will admit it, that is. Those 16 people at the nom rally today–at least 2 of them glbt, guaranteed. at least. and my money's on the big guy with the six kids being one of them.

  • 109. Alan E.  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:40 am

    I have been tagging him and everyone else I know in random peoples facebook pictures (especially the ones where you are caught with a funny face)

  • 110. bJason  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:40 am

    Couldn't make it to ATL today – have been away from the interwebs until yesterday. Finally caught up on the posts. Almost through the Ruling. I was struck by the following section and inspired to adapt it for my mother (who can't see what this stuff does to me). Please enjoy (sorry that it is long, but I think it makes my point).

    NOTE: {} marks denote only grammatical “agreement” changes from the original text. {{}} denotes a substitution of MY NAME for “gays and lesbians”, “homosexuals”, “sex perverts” or the equivalent. ALL OTHER TEXT AND MARKINGS ARE IN THE ORIGINAL.

    From the finding of facts on record in PERRY v. SCHWARZENEGGER (pp. 98 – 101):

    76. Well-known stereotypes about gay men and lesbians include a belief that {{Jason}} {is} affluent, self-absorbed and incapable of forming long-term intimate relationships. Other stereotypes imagine {{Jason}} as {a} disease vector{} or as {a} child molester{} who recruit{s} young children into homosexuality. No evidence supports these stereotypes.

    a. DIX1162 Randy Albelda, et al, Poverty in the Lesbian, Gay, and Bisexual Community, The Williams Institute at 1 (Mar 2009): “A popular stereotype paints {{Jason}} as an affluent elite * * *. [T]he misleading myth of affluence steers policymakers, community organizations service providers, and the media away from fully understanding poverty among LGBT people.”;

    b. Tr 474:12-19 (Chauncey: Medical pronouncements that were hostile to gays and lesbians provided a powerful source of legitimation to anti-homosexual sentiment and were themselves a manifestation of discrimination against {{Jason}}.);

    c. Tr 820:23-822:5 (Meyer: One of the stereotypes that is part of the stigma surrounding gay men and lesbians is that {{Jason}} {is} incapable of, uninterested in and not successful at having intimate relationships. {{Jason}} {has} been described as {a} social isolate{}, as unconnected to society and {one} who do{es} not participate in society the way everyone else does —— as “a pariah, so to speak.”);

    d. PX1011 David Reuben, Everything You Always Wanted to Know About Sex (But Were Afraid to Ask) 129-151 at 143 (Van Rees 1969): “What about all of the homosexuals who live together happily for years? What about them? They are mighty rare birds among the homosexual flock. Moreover, the ‘happy’ part remains to be seen. The bitterest argument between husband and wife is a passionate love sonnet by comparison with a dialogue between a butch and his queen. Live together? Yes. Happily? Hardly.”;

    e. Tr 361:23-363:9 (Chauncey: Even though not all sodomy laws solely penalized homosexual conduct, over the course of the twentieth century, sodomy laws came to symbolize the criminalization of homosexual sex in particular. This was most striking in Bowers v Hardwick, which reads as though the law at issue simply bears on homosexual sex when in fact the Georgia law at issue criminalized both homosexual and heterosexual sodomy.);

    f. Tr 484:24-485:5 (Chauncey: The federal government was slow to respond to the AIDS crisis, and this was in part because of the association of AIDS with a “despised group.”);

    g. Tr 585:22-586:8 (Peplau: There is no empirical support for the negative stereotypes that {{Jason}} ha{s} trouble forming stable relationships or that those relationships are inferior to heterosexual relationships.);

    h. PX2337 Employment of Homosexuals and Other Sex Perverts in Government, S Rep No 81-241, 81st Congress, 2d Sess (1950) at 4: “Most of the authorities agree and our investigation has shown that the presence of {{Jason}} in a Government agency tends to have a corrosive influence on his fellow employees. Th{is} pervert{} will frequently attempt to entice normal individuals to engage in perverted practices. This is particularly true in the case of young and impressionable people who might come under the influence of {{Jason}}. Government officials have the responsibility of keeping this type of corrosive influence out of the agencies under their control. It is particularly important that the thousands of young men and women who are brought into Federal jobs not be subjected to that type of influence while in the service of the Government. One homosexual can pollute a Government office.”;

    i. Tr 395:6-25 (Chauncey: Like most outsider groups, there have been stereotypes associated with gay people; indeed, a range of groups, including medical professionals and religious groups, have worked in a coordinated way to develop stereotypical images of {{Jason}}.);

    j. Tr 397:2-6; Tr 397:25-398:5 (Chauncey: “[I]n some ways, the most dangerous stereotypes for homosexuals really developed between the 1930s and ‘50s, when there were a series of press and police campaigns that identified {{Jason}} as {a} child molester{}.” These press campaigns against assaults on children focused on sex perverts or sex deviants. Through these campaigns, {{Jason}} emerged as a sex deviant.);

    k. PX2281 George Chauncey, The Postwar Sex Crime Panic, in William Graebner, ed, True Stories from the Past 160, 171 (McGraw-Hill 1993): Contains excerpts from wide- circulation Coronet Magazine, Fall 1950: “Once {{Jason}} assumes the role of homosexual, he often throws off all moral restraints. * * * Some male sex deviants do not stop with infecting their often-innocent partners: they descended through perversions to other forms of depravity, such as drug addiction, burglary, sadism, and even murder.”;

    l. Tr 400:18-401:8 (Chauncey: This excerpt from Coronet Magazine, PX2281 at 171, depicts {{Jason}} as {a} subject{} of moral decay. In addition, there is a sense of homosexuality as a disease in which the carriers infect other people. And the term “innocent” pretty clearly indicates that the authors are talking about children.);

    m. PX2281 Chauncey, The Postwar Sex Crime Panic, at 170-171: Contains a statement made by a Special Assistant Attorney General of California in 1949: “The sex pervert, in his more innocuous form, is too frequently regarded as merely a ‘queer’ individual who never hurts anyone but himself. * * * All too often we lose sight of the fact that {{Jason}} is an inveterate seducer of the young of both sexes * * * and is ever seeking for younger victims.”;

    n. Tr 402:21-24 (Chauncey: These articles (in PX2281) were mostly addressed to adults who were understandably concerned about the safety of their children, and who “were being taught to believe that {{Jason}} posed a threat to their children.”);

    o. Tr 407:8-408:4 (Chauncey: One of the most enduring legacies of the emergence of these stereotypes is the creation and then reenforcement of a series of demonic images of homosexuals that stay with us today. This fear of {{Jason}} as {a} child molester{} or as {a} recruiter{} continues to play a role in debates over gay rights, and with particular attention to gay teachers, parents and married couples —— people who might have close contact with children.);

    p. Tr 1035:13-1036:19 (Lamb: Social science studies have disproven the hypothesis that {{Jason}} {is} more likely to abuse children.).

  • 111. adambink  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:42 am

    All, the must-see interview between Arisha and Alveda King is up.

  • 112. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:42 am

    Isn't it though?

  • 113. Straight Grandmother  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:42 am

    I must have caught it right after it was posted and gave her Props in an earlier post, she deserves it.

  • 114. Ann S.  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:43 am

    Alan, I lost the thread where you said you might need legal help, but let me know if you do.

  • 115. Steve  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:43 am

    That raises the question: if we can't risk it now, how are we supposed get any data on its success or lack thereof? Maybe a controlled experiment on an isolated island?

    And if you take that argument to its logical conclusion, nothing would ever get done and nothing would ever change.

  • 116. AndrewPDX  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:46 am

    Signing what petition, Sagesse? Or was that just a fancy "subscribing" post?


  • 117. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:46 am

    Eden–Tampa has been changed to a church in the Winter Park section of Orlando.

  • 118. Kathleen  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:48 am

    BIG HUGS to ARISHA. You've been doing an awesome job. I'm not sure if we tell you often enough.


  • 119. Regan DuCasse  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:50 am

    Arisha, sister… hear me.
    I think I can speak for several people here about your tears.

    It's as if a veil was pulled over Alveda King's head and she lost her direction.
    NOM and their supporters are flipping the script of what injustice and inequality means and as if the true legacy of those things are being well met by them.
    I might be wrong, but perhaps I sense grief at the fact that such people are claiming that they are on the receiving end of injustice.

    That theirs is the mantle of carrying on despite barriers and burdens. That having to give speeches, and spend money traveling and being in the media, is a hardship and sacrifice.
    Indeed, what they do…is further strip away the meaning and importance of what gay people have endured through the centuries.
    They are literally taking your light, your impetus and stealing courage and pushing you aside.
    Those of us who are supportive of our gay family, allow them to speak the truth of their experience and their humanity.
    NOM is stealing it away.

    In so many ways, the gay experience mirrors what expectations the dominant culture has had for both blacks and gays.
    That we are not to challenge or contradict het people. That they are the only ones intimately expert in the intentions and motives of gay people. That gay people are to live like children. Not form romantic bonds, not have sex, not raise children, not have jobs, and not be more intelligent and compassionate than those who oppress them.
    And certainly not show any hurt, anger or joy that utterly divulges our humanity.

    A black person should be able to relate to that. Because that's how blacks were expected to behave and live.
    Add to that, the myths around sexuality: gay and black men are threatening, aggressive and without moral maturity. Black men threatened white women and had an unnatural, insatiable attraction to them. For gay men it's children, especially boys.

    With black women, racists found them a once compelling and repellent, while exploiting the same. This also holds true for lesbians.

    There is far more that parallels interests, struggles and concerns than what is given credit for.
    Blacks wanted equal opportunity, education, housing and protection from injustice in the criminal and penal system and casual violence.
    The same is true for gay people.
    Some of us are willing to have that conversation and commiserate. Ms. King is not.

    Rep. John Lewis, Andrew Young, and Julian Bond know and are with you and me on this.
    So are the venerated Maya Angelou and Cornel West.
    There are better more quality supporters who were front line Movement soldiers than Ms. King.

    I had a moment, where I couldn't stop crying. And the movement was over ten thousand miles away, in China.
    The siege at Tiannamen Square. The students, so many thousands of them had their arms linked.
    They were singing.
    I couldn't believe my ears at WHAT they were singing.

    In China. In Tiannamen Square.
    That they knew the song, and sang it in English was astonishing, poignant and powerful beyond words.
    They were singing "We Shall Overcome."
    And for the love of our gay and trans brothers and sisters…
    Arisha…we will too.
    We will. We will.

  • 120. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:51 am

    Well said, ALan. this reminds me of when Robin Roberts of GMA went back home to New Orleans after Katrina in her job with them. As she walked through the neighborhoods she had known as a child, she wept openly. What that showed me was that Robin Roberts is enough of a professional journalist to not care what people would think if they saw her crying. It showed me that she was enough of a professional to let her humanity show, and to let folks see how this tragedy affected her. Arisha, you rock!

  • 121. Alan E.  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:53 am

    I'll send you a message on Facebook

  • 122. Sagesse  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:54 am

    Yup. To petition, as in to seek or to beg.

  • 123. Ann S.  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:55 am

    Arisha, you did a wonderful, wonderful job with that interview, as you always do.

  • 124. VRAlbany  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:56 am

    Hmmm… the moon shot analogy is not a good argument at all, but a great way for reactionary-minded people to rationalize away facts. I bet some people will go on for decades saying, " [x amount of time] is not enough to determine the impact of same sex marriages on children. Oh, it will have an impact, we just can't see it yet!" But hopefully that won't last for too many decades.
    It's similar to the, "You'll see! When the rapture occurs and Jesus returns, you sinners will wish you could repent!" conversation ender. People have used that for centuries, and will for centuries more when they get tired of being shown that maybe they're wrong, and that the things they have been taught to fear are actually harmless.

    It's sad, really, that they are so full of fear with so little* evidence or justification of that fear.

    *none, in my opinion.

  • 125. Steve  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:56 am

    Alveda King is obviously a religious nutjob. That's all anyone needs to know about her.

  • 126. VRAlbany  |  August 7, 2010 at 7:57 am


  • 127. Alan E.  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:05 am

    OMFG She is ridiculous. Everything she is saying about races can be equally applied to sexuality.

  • 128. ElsieH  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:05 am

    Jason, this is BRILLIANT!

    I'm going to try framing the issue this way the next time I get together with my fundie relatives.

  • 129. Alan E.  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:08 am

    I love the moon shot analogy for many reasons:

    1) There were so many things that could have gone wrong, but we did it anyway.
    2) There were some times when something did go wrong, but some of those times we were able to come together to solve those problems without scrapping the whole thing (until money became an issue and the Cold War ended).
    3) For those times that did go wrong and there was nothing that could be done to fix it, we learned from it and worked to fix whatever issues were involved without scrapping the whole program.

  • 130. VRAlbany  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:13 am

    Yeah, she can't seriously be worried about us all going "extinct".
    Ummm… someone should tell her we all know what goes into making babies now. It's not like the same sex couples who want children will stand around going, "Well Sh*t! How does this work again? We didn't account for this!"
    They to have the right to get surrogates/donors (to Ms. King's horror and disapproval, I'm sure). Or get this… they can adopt the children that heterosexual people can't seem to stop having!

    But if she means that she's not ready for her exclusionary and narrow definition of marriage and family to be extinct, then I'd say she's justified in being worried. :-)

  • 131. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:14 am

    And I thought Brian and Maggie were experienced spin doctors! Dr. Alveda has had plenty of experience with spin as well. NO wonder Arisha had tears.

  • 132. Marius  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:14 am

    Thank you Arisha for being who you are and standing up for all of us, even though you did not have to. I can honestly say that after seeing this video you became one of heroes. You are amazing, and i don't think we lgbt people could ask for a better ally than you! Thanks for being there for us and all the amazing things you do for us!

    As for the rest of the currge campagin and people helping out, thanks from the bottom of my heart!


  • 133. Ray in MA  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:15 am

    Took me a while to get that! go play on a word!

  • 134. Sagesse  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:16 am

    She just has her own set of bumper stickers. "I believe in the law of God." Any other point of view can be dismissed.

  • 135. Ray in MA  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:17 am

    Nice music to blog by.

  • 136. Josiah  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:20 am

    Thanks for sharing that, Ann. The love between your brother and his husband really comes through.

  • 137. Roger  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:20 am

    She is going to be extinct in due course anyway, gay marriage or no gay marriage.

  • 138. Skemono  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:20 am

    10 years is woefully inadequate to determine the impact of these social experimental unions on children

    Because as we all know, current measures of adjustment and well-being are not indicative of the future. Sure, now children of gay parents may be perfectly well-adjusted, happy, healthy, and no different from their peers raised by opposite-sex couples… but at any moment I expect them to realize that they've been raised by same-sex couples and go on a murder spree!

    For that "small deviation" to create a large mess later, there needs to be a "small deviation" in the first place. All our studies have proven otherwise.

    And if 10 years is somehow "woefully inadequate", how about 25 years?

    Every medical, psychological, and child-welfare organization to have addressed the topic has concluded what plaintiffs know from their own family experiences: children of same-sex parents are as healthy, happy, and well adjusted as their peers. These experts meticulously have examined the social science — more than 50 peer-reviewed studies conducted over 25 years — to reach a (rare) consensus that there is no relationship between the gender or sexual orientation of parents and the well-being of their children.

    Oh, wait, that was from an Amici Curiae filed in 2002. So make it 33 years, now.

    And it's not like gays and lesbians have only had children now. They've been raising kids for decades, and we can check how those children do as adults… and have.

  • 139. Sagesse  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:24 am

    I know the King family has lived in conflict and tension for years, but this woman has squandered and dismissed a beautiful legacy. A genuine concern for making things better for all citizens is now getting off on telling others how to live their lives…. because we poor stupid people wouldn't know if she wasn't there to tell us. And send $5, $10, $25.

  • 140. Ann S.  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:29 am

    "Dr." Alveda King just had to work in that dig at Coretta Scott King, didn't she? She shares Dr. Martin Luther King's DNA, so she's better than a mere wife. What utter BS.

  • 141. Sinnerviewer  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:30 am

    The very fact that she is alive guarantees that she will not be extinct. What a stupid statement…

  • 142. Roger  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:34 am

    Yes, big HUGS!!!

  • 143. Roger  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:37 am

    The mantle of Martin Luther King has not fallen on his niece's shoulders.

  • 144. Anonygrl  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:37 am

    Listening to that video, half the time I wanted to SPIT at Alveda King. Arisha I am SO sorry that you had to stand there and listen to her basically say that just about everything that her uncle stood for was wrong, and say that love is not meant for us.

    I am not a black woman, so there are parts of your particular outlook that I will only ever be able to understand peripherally, Arisha. I think, though, if I had been there, listening to that woman trying to dismantle and warp the work of Martin Luther King, Jr. with her marshmallow fluff about "not the courts, GOD" and her "I went to jail for it!" I would have probably shown less restraint than you did.

    I would say that you were absolutely remarkable. In many ways, what someone like Alveda King does with her seemingly gentle and sweet words is more violent and vicious than men like Larry and his sign, because if she actually lived through the struggle, she really should know better.

    As I listened to her words about one race, about love and dignity and respect I wanted to say "How can you say that, then turn around and use the EXACT hateful rhetoric that was used against your people then against mine now? Extinction? That was one of the fears expressed about interracial marriage. Your struggle was one of minorities granted rights by the courts, but now that you are in the majority, the courts should not be considered, the majority should get to oppress? Do you not SEE what you do here?"

    "I have the same DNA" and Coretta Scott King was only married to him???? I can't even BEGIN to address that one. Nor begin to address how she renders insignificant marriage itself with that idea. Here is the letter she references.
    It is more of the same "homosexuality is an evil choice" noise that we all know and love so well. It is basically 35 pages of crap, and I hope, for her sake, that when it arrived, Coretta tossed it without reading it. I likewise recommend that none of you bother with it either. My kitten is being overstretched already with demands for kitty cuddling to sooth my soul, and I don't know if he has enough left to sooth all of you if you read it. (But he will try)

    If Alveda had any respect at all for her father and her uncle, even if she felt what she seems to feel about same sex marriage (and I wonder how much of that is because she was paid to feel that way) she would simply not speak, or if she did, she would not invoke those men whose amazing struggles she trivializes every time she opens her mouth.

    So, Arisha, absolutely NO complaints from any of us for your honest and heart felt reaction. You have done amazing work, and I hope that someone there takes you out for a stiff drink (if you drink) and a great dinner, and tells you how amazing you are over and over and over again until you are dizzy with it, because you ARE amazing, and we love you!

  • 145. Eden James  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:38 am

    Right. Brain cramp.

  • 146. JonT  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:38 am

    I concur.

  • 147. Roger  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:39 am

    You mean that she is alive today proves she is immortal?

  • 148. Josiah  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:40 am

    Ah, Josiah Clark Nott. Not one of my favorite namesakes.

    When the marriage equality opponents start saying "the studies show that children do best with a mother and a father", we need to be ready to answer, "No, actually, the studies show that children do best with two parents. There's no statistical difference in outcomes between families with opposite-gender parents and same-gender parents."

    I think that we equality supporters sometimes get a bit flat-footed when the opponents bring up statistics about children of single parents, because we tend to be good feminists and want to support the rights of single parents as well as LGBTQ couples. But we can't let the slight-of-hand substitution of single parents for LGBT parents go unchallenged. And the facts are that although there is a difference in outcomes for children of single parents, there is no discernible difference in outcome for children of gay and lesbian parents.

  • 149. JonT  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:47 am

    Hmm, I'll play:

    Sugar-Bear Niagra

  • 150. Ray in MA  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:48 am

    Arisha, you are giving so much under so much pressure, it's admirable that you keep on keepin' on.

    On top if it all, the constant 'spin' you keep getting from these people makes my blood boil from 600 miles away, and for you, it's in your face. Your composure under this stress has been remakable.

    As I've said to others on your team, Thank You for what you do. THANK YOU from the inner core of my being. I hope you can understand that.

  • 151. VRAlbany  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:50 am

    Arisha, you are awesome!

  • 152. Anna Bryan  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:51 am

    OMG, I got to page where she starts talking about sickness, and I decided at that point she is a lunatic, so I didn't bother to go forward.

    I believe we should be able to put people like Alveda King in mental institutions and throw away the key. Can we vote on that?

  • 153. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:51 am

    And just think–this group of spinning tops is going to be in my area three days from now. Joy, joy!

  • 154. Anonygrl  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:52 am

    "Some would say that there are many more [equality] protestors here than [NOM] supporters,” Brian Brown said.

    Only those who have enough math skills to multiply the number of NOM supporters who showed up by 15, Brian.

  • 155. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:52 am

    If she can vote on my right to legally marry my husband, then yes, I should be able to vote on her right to be outside of the mental institution.

  • 156. Sinnerviewer  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:55 am

    She also talks about how she was almost aborted. I wish someone would remind her that gay couples don't have abortions. From the way that they speak about gay marriage and children needing a mother and a father, I think what they really need to do is turn their attention to getting divorce banned for any couples with children under 18. Let's see how many people would support that…

  • 157. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:55 am

    You mean those of us who have eyes to see and actually use them without the rose-colored glasses? And yes, I will try to find a video of the song, just for the folks at NOM. Unless there is another country music fan here who remembers John Conlee and finds it before I do.

  • 158. Tracy  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:55 am

    I have to completely agree with you on all of this. I was shocked to hear from Alveda King that sharing the blood of Martin Luther King, Jr, means that he was more likely to share her views than that of his own wife. I was born and raised in the South, and some of my ancestors fought for slavery — if I believed that "shared blood" had anything to do with social views, I would never be able to show my face to the world again.

    Thank God that "shared blood" is meaningless; that our collective wisdom is continuously shaped by our experiences and the world around us; that as time goes on, and generations pass, we become more wise as a people – one large community that recognizes that discrimination in ALL its forms is evil.

    Arisha, I find amazing the role you have chosen to play in this drama — you have put yourself on the front lines, and history is unfolding around you. You are so brave and yet so privileged to be experiencing this sea change in how marriage is viewed throughout the world. Hats off to you for soldiering forward, and thank you for standing firm by your principles.

  • 159. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:57 am

    I found it! So here, in honor of all those at NOM who think they outnumber us so badly, John Conlee and a very appropriate song, especially the chorus.

    [youtube =]

  • 160. Anonygrl  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:58 am

    I think she gets a BIG old bless your heart…

    Bless your heart, (Honorary) Dr. (of some variety of Liberal Arts) Alveda "I'm a big supporter of marriage, but my married name doesn't get me as many speaking gigs as my uncle's name so I'll keep his" King. Bless your heart for all you do to point out how wrong your uncle was, that it is GOOD and PROPER for the majority to oppress the minority. Thanks for that, and bless your heart.

  • 161. Straight Ally #3008  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:00 am

    A right delayed is a right denied.

    -Martin Luther King, Jr.

  • 162. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:01 am

    Eden, can you find the link to the post where you shared Arisha's reasons for joining Courage Campaign? If I remember correctly, Arisha was prepping for the bar and her boss said she was passing her luck to Arisha, and then when Prop H8 passed, Arisha felt that this was a way for her to give that luck back.

  • 163. JonT  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:01 am

    Hmm, but I thought the universe was only 6000 years old?!?

  • 164. Tracy  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:03 am

    Regarding ancestry – one of my family, many generations back, used his position in the North Carolina legislature to spur his state to contribute one of the largest contingent of soldiers to the Confederate Army – to defend slavery. He wrote a long, eloquent treatise on the benefits and virtues of slavery. I am proud to say that I would be one of the first to sign up for the Union army and fight against my own blood to eliminate slavery.

    Alveda King should be ashamed of herself, for she has tainted a shining and noble legacy that most of us will never know. Shame on her. But don't let her rhetoric taint that legacy — Martin Luther King, Jr was a hero, and I must believe that he would have had the wisdom to recognize civil rights for ALL.

  • 165. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:07 am

    Tracy, are you still in North Carolina? And if you are, where in the Tar Heel State?

  • 166. Tracy  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:09 am

    I envy you Richard — the tops aren't spinning to the Bay Area any time soon!

  • 167. Tracy  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:11 am

    Richard, I am no longer in the Tar Heel State, though most of my family are. I have moved to the lovely, temperate, and recently SSM-friendly Bay Area!

  • 168. Tracy  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:12 am

    And I have to say congrats to you and the lovely Mr. Jernigan, on the recent Prop 8 decision. I am hoping it will spread to the East Coast in record time….

  • 169. fiona64  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:13 am

    I don't think Jiggs Glencoe is a very good drag name … I think I've been short-changed.


  • 170. fiona64  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:15 am

    This is one of those weird remnants of the Chinese Exclusion Act, if I understand correctly.

    It was extraordinarily complicated. The original book "Flower Drum Song" (not so much the musical) is about the problems that resulted from that law. It was very enlightening.


  • 171. Tracy  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:18 am

    Richard, you're wonderful! :)

  • 172. Sagesse  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:18 am

    "But we can’t let the slight-of-hand substitution of single parents for LGBT parents go unchallenged. And the facts are that although there is a difference in outcomes for children of single parents, there is no discernible difference in outcome for children of gay and lesbian parents."

    Josiah, we should also not lose sight of the fact that there is a correlation with poverty, and many single parent households struggle financially.

  • 173. Ann S.  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:31 am

    @Fiona, I don't think it was the Chinese Exclusion Act in the case of my parents' marriage in CA, it was the same sort of law as the one in Loving v. Virginia. The plaintiffs in the CA Su. Ct. case analogous to Loving v. Virginia (the case is Perez v. Sharp) were a white woman and a black man. According to Wikipedia, the law read: "All marriages of white persons with Negroes, Mongolians, members of the Malay race, or mulattoes are illegal and void,” and also on Section 69, which stated that ". . . no license may be issued authorizing the marriage of a white person with a Negro, mulatto, Mongolian or member of the Malay race".[4] At the time, California's anti-miscegenation statute had banned interracial marriage since 1850, when it first enacted a statute prohibiting whites from marrying blacks or mulattoes."

  • 174. fiona64  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:36 am

    Welcome, Ray!


  • 175. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:38 am

    I envy all of you out there, because you are in the thick of things with the trial and all. Look us up the next time you come to NC. We are just below Ft. Bragg in Hope Mills. Wish you could be here on Tuesday. Would love to meet you.

  • 176. fiona64  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:39 am

    Thanks for clarifying, Ann.

    I think one of the reasons I jumped to that conclusion was that there were still Federal laws on the books well into the 1960s that said is a Caucasian woman married a Chinese man, her citizenship was forfeit … among a whole bunch of other bizarre and complicated matters solely related to one party or the other being of Asian heritage.


  • 177. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:39 am

    Speaking of tops, let's see if Ronnie can find us any music from The Four Tops. Any of their celebration songs will do.

  • 178. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:41 am

    @ Tracy: From your mouth to G-d's ears. And I think by this time of day she has turned off the answering machine and is taking the calls directly. LOL! Love being a Jew. We can find joy in almost anything.

  • 179. Anonygrl  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:42 am

    My "On the NOM bus" episode from the other day actually DID put the rally on the bus. Tee hee!

  • 180. Mike Kilpatrick  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:42 am

    "Gays and lesbians stood up for civil rights in Montgomery, Selma, in Albany, Ga. and St. Augustine, Fla., and many other campaigns of the Civil Rights Movement," she said. "Many of these courageous men and women were fighting for my freedom at a time when they could find few voices for their own, and I salute their contributions."

    Alveda King should be ashamed of herself.

  • 181. Mike Kilpatrick  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:43 am

    "We are all tied together in a single garment of destiny…I can never be what I ought to be until you are allowed to be what you ought to be," she said, quoting her husband. "I've always felt that homophobic attitudes and policies were unjust and unworthy of a free society and must be opposed by all Americans who believe in democracy."

    Coretta Scott King

  • 182. Mike Kilpatrick  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:44 am

    “Gays and lesbians stood up for civil rights in Montgomery, Selma, in Albany, Ga. and St. Augustine, Fla., and many other campaigns of the Civil Rights Movement,” she said. “Many of these courageous men and women were fighting for my freedom at a time when they could find few voices for their own, and I salute their contributions.”

    Coretta Scott King

  • 183. Mike Kilpatrick  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:44 am

    For too long, our nation has tolerated the insidious form of discrimination against this group of Americans, who have worked as hard as any other group, paid their taxes like everyone else, and yet have been denied equal protection under the law…I believe that freedom and justice cannot be parceled out in pieces to suit political convenience. My husband, Martin Luther King, Jr. said, "Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere." On another occasion he said, "I have worked too long and hard against segregated public accommodations to end up segregating my moral concern. Justice is indivisible." Like Martin, I don't believe you can stand for freedom for one group of people and deny it to others.

    Coretta Scott King

  • 184. Tracy  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:45 am

    @Richard, you are so, so, so inspiring to me. I find joy in so few things — I have to wonder what I've been missing? :) But I will vicariously enjoy your joy!

  • 185. Mike Kilpatrick  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:45 am

    "Homophobia is like racism and anti-Semitism and other forms of bigotry in that it seeks to dehumanize a large group of people, to deny their humanity, their dignity and personhood."

    Coretta Scott King

  • 186. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:46 am

    Glad you like it, Tracy. And it does seem to fit how they look at their turnout, doesn't it?

  • 187. Ronnie  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:47 am

    Nothing like a good Medley…<3…Ronnie

  • 188. Tracy  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:52 am

    @Richard, I'd love to meet you too! Unfortunately, I don't make to NC very often — I have aunts and uncles in NC (Clover, Wilmington, etc.), but my parents live in Greenville, SC, about 4-5 hour drive from you. When I have time off, I can visit them, but I would rarely make it to NC. :(

    But I would love to hear about the NOM rally from you, if you are able to attend! Keeping in touch would be great! All my best,


  • 189. Ann S.  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:54 am

    @Fiona, I know there were some really bizarre laws having to do with Chinese exclusion. My mother is a US citizen of Chinese heritage (born in Honolulu) and my father is a US citizen, I don't think either was ever in danger of losing their citizenship over their marriage.

    I was actually born in North Carolina but we left when I was still an infant. I've never asked them about what it was like for them there, with their marriage probably being illegal and all, although they have told me other stories about NC.

    Here's one: my birth certificate says I am Caucasian. When I asked my mother why it doesn't say anything about my Asian heritage, she said that basically, in that time and place, you were either "white" or "colored", and you didn't want your birth certificate to say "colored".

  • 190. mike  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:54 am

    being gay isnt a selfish choice it's a quality that is impossible to change. it can only be covered up. gay people aren't selfish their physical sexuality developed toward a man instead of a woman or vice versa.

  • 191. Dpeck  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:54 am

    Yeah. Statistics. Like this one:

    Statistically, looking at the entire adult population of any major city, the average person has one female breast.

    Statistics can be correct and totally misleading at the same time, if you know how to arrange the math. Just sayin'.

  • 192. Ann S.  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:59 am

    @Dpeck, here's a good one I heard at a talk by Robert Reich (Sec. of Labor under Pres. Clinton) (it helps to know that Reich is 4 feet 10.5 inches tall): if he and Shaquille O'Neal are in a room, the average person is a man 6 ft. tall.

    OK, that no doubt plays much better in person.

  • 193. Dave in ME  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:59 am

    That is such a bizarre thing to day. This will KILL her?!?!?

    I've been gone all day and there are almost two hundred comments I DIDN'T get in my inbox!


  • 194. Anna Bryan  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:00 am

    NOM launches Religous Liberty "No Offense" ad campaign.

    Clealry, they are still unsure what to put here…

  • 195. Joel  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:00 am

    I'm a SoCal native, born and bred. I've been to North Carolina a few times, but never for long. My friend, whose drag name is Iona Traylor, may be back there, though. I think he was originally from that area, and was not having a great time in Long Beach.
    Barkerville is a street in Whittier, CA.

    I win? Really? I'd like to take the opportunity to thank the Academy…

  • 196. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:01 am

    And it goes back even further. The woman who struggled to ensure that Aveda King even has the right to vote was a lesbian. Susan B. Anthony.

  • 197. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:03 am

    And I would think that the woman who lived in the same house with Dr. Martin Luther King would know more about how he thought and how he felt, than his niece would. After all, spouses do come to each know or at least sense how the other thinks and feels over the course of their relationship..

  • 198. mike  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:06 am

    I really wonder where NOM is getting off with this whole, if it were 1960 we would be leading the civil rights movement pro inter-racial marriage… I call bullsh*t, and I'm suprised they don't realize how obvious a fallacy it is.

  • 199. FreeATLast  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:07 am

    Great showing at the rally today! The best part was when Brian Brown asked the audience if they would let their voices be silenced by the activist crowd across the street, and the handful of audience members let out a meek, deflated, almost whispered "no." The throng of us across the street (250+) couldn't help but laugh.

    I have some pics from the event. Does anyone know how I could post them to the site?

  • 200. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:10 am

    Thanks, Ronnie. Yet another class act that started out classy and even though their clothing styles changed with the times, they stayed classy.

  • 201. Kathleen  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:10 am

    For a bit of levity (and for those who don't have a twitter or fb account), some recent tweets from be4marriage "Anna Bryan"

    We are in Atlanta for the rally. There's no gays here, right? Tired of them showing up with huge groups of supporters. #no4m #marriagetour

    Almost time for the rally. Let's spread some love for gays by denying them access to a civil right and isolating them from society #no4m

    The gays are disrupting our marriage tour with their free speech. We are working on a law to stop that. #nogayrights #no4m

    Alveda King at rally: If gays and lesbians are allowed to marry, heterosexuals will stop having sex and popping out children #NOMsense #NO4M

    We like to verbally attack people, eliminate their legal rights, and then go running to the courts if they speak against us. #no4m

    15 marriage inequality supporters at our rally today. You each owe us $5,000 to cover Ms. King's speaking fee. Visa accepted. #no4m

    The only thing that our marriage tour is proving is that gays and lesbians care much more about marriage than our supporters. #no4m

    Unless more than 16 people come out for the next marriage rally, we aren't setting up the podium and loud speakers. #toomuchtrouble #no4m

    Anna has also sent a number of tweets which remind us of what MLK said, but the above are her contributions to lighten the mood.

  • 202. Joel  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:13 am

    Hunh? The ABA? The American Bar Association? Sorry, I'm lost in a sea of acronyms. Doesn't the ABA support Marriage equality and adoption rights for gay and lesbian couples?

  • 203. MJFargo  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:14 am

    I mean no respect to Dr. Alveda King, but claiming she "knows" what her uncle thinks because she shares his genes (and Coretta Scott King doesn't) is specious. As well, when you ask someone involved in the civil rights movement what role the court has played in further civil rights, and the response is "I get my strength from G-d," well, that's avoiding the question and denying history. Whether her name gives NOM more or less credibility is really an individual choice by the listener. I found her sincere and suspicious of a government that enslaved her race for centuries. I would have liked to ask her what she thought of the fellow who carried a sign with two nooses on it as his recommendation for dealing with homosexuals. Perhaps, then, she could have a better understanding of what LGB&T people deal with.

  • 204. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:17 am

    Oh, yes, we can keep in touch. I have your email from your comment on my blog, so I will email you soon. You can also find me on Facebook. Same name as here (minus what's in parentheses, of course). And if you have Skype I will send you my Skype handle in the email.

  • 205. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:19 am

    Ann, where in North Carolina were you born? We are in Hope Mills, which is just below Fayetteville/Ft. Bragg.

  • 206. Kathleen  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:22 am

    We just need 433,971 signatures on a petition in California and we can get it on the ballot. If you think it will require a Constitutional amendment to accomplish our goal, we'll need 694,354.

  • 207. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:24 am

    I think you do it by first uploading them to flickr or photobucket, then posting the link here.

  • 208. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:26 am

    Anna, you are brilliant! So glad you are on the marriage equality side.

  • 209. Anna Bryan  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:27 am

    Thanks hon for reposting, reading them all together like that made me chuckle.

    I really do hope I'm not offending anyone at NOM – really…

  • 210. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:27 am

    Joel, I think that is one of the comments posted by someone after they read the article. I read the article and that wasn't in the article itself.

  • 211. Ann S.  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:28 am

    @Joel — sorry, yes, the American Bar Association. I believe at their annual meeting (coincidentally, this weekend in SF) they are voting on a resolution to support Marriage equality and adoption rights for gay and lesbian couples, but I haven't heard if they actually took the vote yet.

  • 212. Ann S.  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:29 am

    Joel, I tried to answer you so it would show up after your question, and failed. Yes, the American Bar Association, sorry, and I don't think they've yet voted on marriage equality (but they might be doing it this weekend).

  • 213. Sagesse  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:30 am

    The Atlanta Journal-Constitution can count, and has pictures.

  • 214. Anna Bryan  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:31 am

    Oh, I think that bit about knowing what MLK thinks because she shares his DNA is the sanest thought she expressed all day.

    And every father that has ever had a teenage daughter would agree with her 100% too, I'm sure.

  • 215. Ann S.  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:32 am

    @Richard, I was born in Raleigh, but we left before I was a year old.

  • 216. Sagesse  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:34 am

    From Salt Lake City

    Interfaith leader calls gay marriage legal issue

  • 217. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:34 am

    And now we know how they are attempting to raise money. They are selling buttons at each stop. wonder how much one is? $1,000? $2,000? $10,000?

  • 218. Mark  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:37 am

    Hi everyone,

    This is my first post, though I've been following this avidly for some time now. Can't tell you how awed I am by the incredible work being done by the people here. My husband and I will celebrate the second anniversary of our still legal California marriage on September 6, though we've been in a committed relationship since 1994. I hope this comment isn't out of line, but I loved the remark about NOM handing out sheets and hoods in order to get more people to turn out. These people are, after all, hetero-supremacists, which was part of the finding in Judge Walker's brilliant decision (what a compelling read!). I wonder what MLK, Jr. would think of his own niece trading on his name and legacy as part of any supremacist movement (and all while apparently chewing gum, I might add)? Again, I hope that's not out of line, but I get so angry when NOM tries to co-opt our position by saying it's a "civil right" to vote issue, that they are being harassed and intimidated (so far I haven't read of any NOM-bashing incidents), and that they are somehow the victims in this struggle. To Arisha and all you guys working so tirelessly and with such inspiring dignity for what is right: thank you from the bottom of our hearts. Mark & Mark

  • 219. Lightning Baltimore  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:38 am

    I wondered, at first, if the big, empty space in the middle of the page was a problem in IE, so I tried Chrome. Nope, nothing there, either. Then, I tried Firefox, and it worked. I guess their webmaster is not aware of the need to test multiple browsers.

    Once again, they hire the incompetent.


  • 220. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:39 am

    This is a man with common sense. A Baptist minister who knows what the separation of church and state means. Oh, how I wish we could get him in a televised debate with BB, MG, and LJM and the others like them.

  • 221. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:41 am

    Welcome to the P8TT family, Mark and Mark. Hope to see more of you on here. And if you are on FB, we have a Prop 8 Trial Tracker group there, as well. Feel free to join us.

  • 222. silverlaker  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:42 am

    Arisha, you rock!! I follow this blog every day and you never cease to amaze me. It makes me very proud to know that you are out there standing up for equality in your thoughtful, polite and articulate way. I sincerely appreciate what you do.

  • 223. Sagesse  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:45 am

    Doesn't work for me in Firefox.

  • 224. Tony Douglass in Ca  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:46 am

    Is that the Stock Photo of Generic Old Couple??

  • 225. Kathleen  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:49 am

    For all out lovers here:

  • 226. Kathleen  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:49 am

    That was supposed to be "our", but out works too. :)

  • 227. Kathleen  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:57 am

    I'm guessing this "going extinct" claim has something to do with some kind of religious belief that her god will punish her bloodline if she does or doesn't do or think certain things. At least that's what I picked up from reading the first part of the letter to her aunt (which I couldn't finish — too much drivel).

  • 228. Sagesse  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:58 am

    Truth Wins Out: "Or she can go on being a bigoted loon. Her choice."

    Alveda King ‘Betrays Heritage,’ Speaks at Failed NOM Rally in Atlanta

  • 229. Sagesse  |  August 7, 2010 at 11:00 am

    From Joe.My.God

    ATLANTA: MLK's Niece Betrays Heritage And Speaks At NOM's Hate Tour

  • 230. truthspew  |  August 7, 2010 at 11:04 am

    King is spouting the typical Christian bullshit of love the sinner, hate the sin.

    I wish she and people like here would just shut the fuck up for once. Seriously embarrasses the legacy of Dr. Martin Luther King Jr.

  • 231. Mad Professah  |  August 7, 2010 at 11:05 am

    Keep strong, Arisha.

    I understand how painful it can be to have someone who looks like you deny the humanity and dignity of LGBT people all the while claiming to do it in the name of humanity and dignity and ""God."

    I think a question you could have asked Alveda king is "Why is it that you feel your religious views should be encapsulated into law? How do you respond to people who have different (or no) religious views and ideals? Do you believe in separation of church and state?"

  • 232. Lightning Baltimore  |  August 7, 2010 at 11:07 am

    I don't recall if I've said it on here before, but I believe what they mean to say is:

    Hate the sinner; love the sin!

  • 233. Sheryl  |  August 7, 2010 at 11:08 am

    Excuse me, but you just hit a nerve. I was a single parent (left his dad when son was 6 and remarried when he was20). I really take exception to the idea that children raised by single parents do not turn out as well as children raised by 2 parents. Bad enough that the NOMers throw that around but from someone who supports equality, really hits a nerve.

  • 234. Sagesse  |  August 7, 2010 at 11:08 am

    Right-winger: Prop. 8 decision wrong because marriage is really 'a necessary defense of a women's sexuality'

    Or else marriage has evolved into a partnership of equals… one or the other….

  • 235. Greg in Oz  |  August 7, 2010 at 11:10 am

    Late, I know (curse the time difference), but I reckon I take the Drag crown here – mine would be Rinny Kirrawee!!

    Cant do much with THAT name!

    Go on! beat that! LOL

    Greg in Oz

  • 236. Kathleen  |  August 7, 2010 at 11:11 am

    This, from the caption under Alveda King's photo:
    "“King exmphasized the procreation aspect of the gay-marriage debate and voiced her concerns that legalizing gay marriage would mean genocide”

    I'm guessing it's not just the TTers who think these statements are real head-scratchers. :)

  • 237. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 7, 2010 at 11:17 am

    @ Kathleen: Thanks. I think that is going onto the CD I am going to mix for the wedding reception. Along with several versions of Hava Nagila, Battle Hymn of Love, Carrie Underwood/Rascal Flatts God Bless the Broken Road, and Carrie's I Want to Be Inside Your Heaven. I will keep everyone updated on the song selection as it progresses.

  • 238. Skemono  |  August 7, 2010 at 11:26 am

    I really take exception to the idea that children raised by single parents do not turn out as well as children raised by 2 parents.

    Do you have evidence otherwise? My understanding is that there are studies showing clear trends that children of single parents are more likely to have certain problems than those of married parents, although I admit I haven't spent much time researching the issue.

  • 239. Kathleen  |  August 7, 2010 at 11:41 am

    Nice to hear from you Mark & Mark! Your comment isn't out of line at all. This absurd message of theirs–that they're somehow at the forefront of the modern civil rights movement–has been the topic of many a conversation around here.

    So glad you decided to post. Hope you'll stick around.

    And an early HAPPY ANNIVERSARY!!

  • 240. funkifried  |  August 7, 2010 at 11:41 am

    What have Beatrice and Alveda done to their family name?
    These are all quotes from the book Hardly Silnced ( :

    Beatrice King, the youngest daughter of Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr., said at an October 2004 conference in New Zealand, “I know in my sanctified soul that he [Dr. King] did not take a bullet for same-sex marriage.”

    “In Christ, God puts his seed in us. Any other way is a spiritual abortion. Cloning, homosexuality and lesbianism are spiritual abortions. Homosexuality is a manifestation of the fallen man.” – From the sermon, “God is after Himself,” by Bishop and mentor to Bernice King, Eddie L. Long of New Birth Missionary Baptist Church in Atlanta, Georgia

    Alveda King, niece to Dr. King, told a group of Augusta, Maine anti-gay protesters, “God hates racism and God hates homosexuality." – Alveda founded King for America, a faith-based organization

    “Gays and lesbians stood up for civil rights in Montgomery, Selma, in Albany, Georgia, and St. Augustine, Florida, and many other campaigns of the Civil Rights Movement. Many of these courageous men and women were fighting for my freedom at a time when they could find few voices for their own, and I salute their contributions.” – Coretta Scott King (1927-2006), 2004

  • 241. Rodney  |  August 7, 2010 at 11:42 am

  • 242. Kathleen  |  August 7, 2010 at 11:44 am

    Working for me in Firefox on a Mac.

  • 243. FreeATLast  |  August 7, 2010 at 11:52 am


  • 244. Kathleen  |  August 7, 2010 at 11:52 am

    This has probably already been posted, but I can't keep track of what I have and haven't read any more, so just in case:

    National Organization for Marriage rally dwarfed by LGBT counter-protest at Georgia Capitol

  • 245. Kathleen  |  August 7, 2010 at 12:13 pm

    LOL!!! This just proves Walker's point! The "marriage" that these fundies are trying to protect has nothing to do with the marriage most people in our modern society have – one involving two people of equal status.

  • 246. Taelyn  |  August 7, 2010 at 12:18 pm

    except, sorry to be picky, but a baker's dozen is the same as a gross, which is 12 dozen, or 144, and not the same as a dozen at all.

  • 247. Lightning Baltimore  |  August 7, 2010 at 12:21 pm

    A "baker's dozen" is 13, actually, and 15 is slightly more than 13.


  • 248. Lightning Baltimore  |  August 7, 2010 at 12:27 pm


    Marriage is about defending women

    Among the many different versions of marriage in human history, very few of them have supplied the high-minded qualities that the plaintiffs feel is their right. The vast majority of marriages in the past, perhaps a majority even now, were dictated by families, clans, holy men or magicians, and enforced on the bride and groom by social pressure, enforced if necessary with brutality and violence.

    True, many marriages promote loving intimacy and enduring fidelity, but that’s an outcome of the relationship itself – not the raison d’etre for the institution. In primordial terms, marriage only exists at all – in all of its permutations, pleasant or barbaric – because of the nature of human heterosexuality. As a species, we need to protect female sexuality in order to assure ourselves of a future.

    Marriage is a necessary defense of a woman’s sexuality and her human liberty from determined assault by men who would turn her into a slave, a concubine – something less than fully human. Human communities need to give women some additional degree of protection – through law, custom, religious decree, or sacrament – generally some combination of all three, neatly summarized by the plaintiffs, who demanded the sacred and the eternal from the state of California.

    I get it now! We need to restrict marriage to opposite-sex couples so my husband and I don't go around raping women.

    Oh, wait . . .

  • 249. GMCarter  |  August 7, 2010 at 12:29 pm

    Heavens to BETSY! I am SO glad she can ignore courts (tho I can sympathize when it comes to the Supreme Court often)…and gosh golly! She says it's her GOD'S LAW.
    Hmmm….her godlet, aside from being a bit of a nasty fellow (who I gathered was white?)…well, one fellow wrote a note with some questions from another bigot hiding behind her god…
    In her radio show, Dr Laura Schlesinger said that, as an observant Orthodox Jew, homosexuality is an abomination according to Leviticus 18:22, and cannot be condoned under any circumstance. The following response is an open letter to Dr. Laura, penned by a US resident, which was posted on the Internet. It's funny, as well as informative:

    Dear Dr. Laura:

    Thank you for doing so much to educate people regarding God's Law. I have learned a great deal from your show, and try to share that knowledge with as many people as I can. When someone tries to defend the homosexual lifestyle, for example, I simply remind them that Leviticus 18:22 clearly states it to be an abomination … End of debate.

    I do need some advice from you, however, regarding some other elements of God's Laws and how to follow them.

    1. Leviticus 25:44 states that I may possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighboring nations. A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, and Chuukies, but not Canadians. Can you clarify? Why can't I own Canadians?

    2. I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus 21:7. In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for her?

    3. I know that I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in her period of Menstrual uncleanliness – Lev.15: 19-24. The problem is how do I tell? I have tried asking, but most women take offense.

    4. When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a pleasing odor for the Lord – Lev.1:9. The problem is my neighbors. They claim the odor is not pleasing to them. Should I smite them?

    5. I have a neighbor who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly states he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself, or should I ask the police to do it?

    6. A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an abomination, Lev. 11:10, it is a lesser abomination than homosexuality. I don't agree. Can you settle this? Are there 'degrees' of abomination?

    7. Lev. 21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a defect in my sight. I have to admit that I wear reading glasses. Does my vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle-room here?

    8. Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev. 19:27. How should they die?

    9. I know from Lev. 11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes me unclean, but may I still play football if I wear gloves?

    10. My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev.19:19 by planting two different crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing garments made of two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend). He also tends to curse and blaspheme a lot. Is it really necessary that we go to all the trouble of getting the whole town together to stone them? Lev.24:10-16. Couldn't we just burn them to death at a private family affair, like we do with people who sleep with their in-laws? (Lev. 20:14)

    I know you have studied these things extensively and thus enjoy considerable expertise in such matters, so I'm confident you can help.

    Thank you again for reminding us that God's word is eternal and unchanging.

    Your adoring fan,
    James M. Kauffman, Ed.D. Professor Emeritus, Dept. Of Curriculum, Instruction, and Special Education University of Virginia

  • 250. Felyx  |  August 7, 2010 at 12:33 pm

    Oh ___ Her ___ GOD!!!!!

    Does she know what she is saying?… !!!

    . . / . /

    . . O O
    . . –
    . ______

    Just… OMG…


  • 251. Kathleen  |  August 7, 2010 at 12:36 pm

    I'll chime in here as another single parent. I really haven't looked at the studies to know how accurate this claim is, but it may well be true. I can certainly understand why it might be the case that, in general, children with only one parent don't do as well as children with two. But I don't see that as a negative reflection on my parenting or on my children; if anything, I see it as a testament to all of us doing really well in less than ideal circumstances.

    I know that, as a single parent, and one who received almost no child support from my sons' father, I had to work really hard and long hours to provide for my family. Then add into the mix cultural disadvantages that I didn't have to deal with, and It's not hard for me to imagine that people so situated have a hard time offering their children the same advantages that couples, through their combined resources, can give their kids. But that doesn't mean that kids who are raised by a single parent can't thrive. It just means it's statistically less likely that they will.

    I managed eventually to find a fairly high paying job for someone without a college education, one that also provided excellent health insurance (I was a union carpenter). I fought to get my kids scholarships to private schools that, in turn, gave them opportunities they wouldn't have otherwise had. My circle of friends, who were our extended family, exposed them to art, music and theater and instilled values of fairness and diversity. It also drove their desire to study the arts, which has become their career choice.

    My sons are doing great. But I have little doubt that if I had had another adult in the household, with as much devotion to my sons as I had, and just as willing to do the work necessary to be a good parent, that their life would have been just that much richer.

  • 252. Kathleen  |  August 7, 2010 at 12:56 pm

    This is some of the biggest bunch of crazy I've heard in a long time – and I've been following reports of the NOM tour.

  • 253. Felyx  |  August 7, 2010 at 1:04 pm

    I would mention something here…

    I had two parents who raised us all. A 100% NOM and Catholic Church approved marriage…

    I would have been better off raised by dogs. No, seriously.

    I watched a program on feral children and all I could think was, "Sure this is bad but… at least these kids have self-confidence and are not trying to kill themselves!!!"

    This is such a harsh (and possibly highly debatable) opinion but the fact remains, these children will live longer than so many minority children who are murdered or suicide!

    I am so grateful that Papa Foma adopted me. And I cry at night for joy that I have found love in the heart of Brother Russia.

    My divorced and indigent father once told me that a child needs a mother and a father in order to grow up healthy and happy. I looked him in the eyes and said nothing. After that, he replied rather sheepishly, "Not all parents are like your mother and I.(sic"

    I know that all the evidence in the world can't trump the word of God as they know it, but to hear him say that and still not believe that I could be a parent solely for being gay… it boggles the mind.

    I have heard this illogic about everything my whole life… to hear Alveda say it just brings back years of nightmares.

    Felyx – Not into Valveda's Cheesy Fantasies!

  • 254. Josiah  |  August 7, 2010 at 1:34 pm

    C. Welton Gaddy is president of the Interfaith Alliance, a progressive inter-religious organization which emphasizes that the separation of church and state is important not only for the state, but for the church. The founders recognized that when churches get too deeply involved in politics, they get corrupted, and their political ideology can become an idol, superseding the Church's proper mission of service. Too many so-called Christians today never learned this.

    Gaddy is a Baptist who opposed the takeover of the Southern Baptist Convention by fundamentalist theocrats. He's from the same Baptist tradition as Jimmy Carter and Bill Moyers, a tradition which emphasized the priesthood of all believers, the notion that no person or organization can stand between an individual and God, or claim to speak for God. That tradition has become a minority voice in the Baptist community, but it's still vibrant.

  • 255. Josiah  |  August 7, 2010 at 1:46 pm

    @Sagesse: absolutely. The fact that children raised by single parents (usually single mothers) are also more likely to be raised in poverty is hugely important. I don't know what's cause and what's effect there — that single parents have to work so much harder to provide opportunities for their children, and that parents who have to work two or three jobs to make ends meet have less time and energy to meet their children's emotional needs — but there's a real correlation that can't be ignored.

  • 256. Felyx  |  August 7, 2010 at 1:47 pm

    I predict that in 50 years or so, religious institutions will be places nearly all humans will want to belong to… even the retrosexuals.

  • 257. Curious, Just Asking  |  August 7, 2010 at 1:48 pm

    What is a "Retrosexual"?

  • 258. Felyx  |  August 7, 2010 at 1:49 pm

    Someone whose idea of sexuality goes back to the '40's!


  • 259. Felyx  |  August 7, 2010 at 1:51 pm

    Sorry couldn't help myself!!! snicker

  • 260. Ann S.  |  August 7, 2010 at 2:14 pm

    A humorous comment from the ABA Journal:

    ““But no harm will come to the children” say the witnesses. Consider NASA. A small deviation from the norm may mean nothing on the launch pad, but take it out 100,000 miles into space and the flight of the vessel will miss the moon. That is a huge issue. Simply because we cannot adequately see that a small deviation will create a mess later, doesn’t mean it won’t. Even small deviations should be studied for generations before we allow 50,000 years of such unions to be played with by society. 10 years is woefully inadequate to determine the impact of these social experimental unions on children”

    So now we have Toyota brakes, contaminated peanut butter, and a failed moon shot. Analogy FAIL.

  • 261. Josiah  |  August 7, 2010 at 2:17 pm

    @Sheryl, I'm sorry if my phrasing suggested that all children of single parents have poor outcomes — that wasn't what I meant at all. What I meant — and what I think that sociological studies do support — is that on average, children of single parents have more trouble in school, attain a lower level of education and lower socioeconomic status as adults, are more likely to become homeless or experience psychological difficulties, and so forth.

    Now, let's remember that the myth of the average is one of the ways in which statistics are regularly misused in public policy discussions and in day-to-day life. Just because one group has a certain tendency on average, that doesn't mean that all members of that group have that tendency. And it certainly doesn't mean that it's appropriate to assume that because someone is a member of that group, that they will have that tendency.

    Also, just because there is correlation between two factors doesn't mean that one caused the other. As Sagesse points out, poverty is a huge factor in the outcomes I mentioned above, and single parent families are more likely to struggle financially than two-parent families (because, guess what? Raising a kid is expensive!)

    I should be more careful in my wording, to make sure that I don't give the impression that I'm blaming single parents for the statistical outcomes. I know plenty of single moms — and a few single dads — whose kids are doing just fine, thanks. And I'd never suggest that people raising kids alone should be judged or treated as inferior to two-parent families. (If anything, they should be admired and given more support, because they're doing twice as much work.)

    But in a way, this illustrates the point I was making earlier about how we supporters of marriage equality don't respond well to the charge that "children do best with a mother and a father". We try to be good progressives and not say anything that could cause offense, and in so doing we allow opponents of marriage equality to throw around these statistics unchallenged — because it's difficult to talk about these statistics without looking like you're condemning single parents.

    Of course, if you're a bigoted asshole who thinks that the only "real" family is Ozzie and Harriet, you'll feel free to throw around these statistics with abandon, and you won't even care if in so doing you make offensive implications. That's why this line of attack is comparatively effective for them (at least, more effective than a lot of the nonsense they spew).

    Once again, please accept my apology, Sheryl (and anyone else who was offended by my poor choice of words).

  • 262. Tracy  |  August 7, 2010 at 2:25 pm

    WOW. That says it all. :)

  • 263. Josiah  |  August 7, 2010 at 2:26 pm

    @Felyx, that's the flip side of the myth of the average. Even if it were true that the "one man, one woman" model was on average the best type of family for kids to grow up in (and I'm not saying that it is), that wouldn't mean that a particular family of that type is automatically superior to a family of any other type. On the individual level, all statistics are meaningless.

    On average, Americans are more likely to be overweight than people from Europe. But does that mean that it's fair to assume that just because someone is American, they're overweight? Of course not! We all know plenty of skinny Americans. By the same token, there are plenty of single parents (like Sheryl, I presume) who do a great job raising their kids, and plenty of mom-and-dad married couples who should have had their kids taken away from them at birth. That's why you can't make policy decisions based on averages.

  • 264. Dpeck  |  August 7, 2010 at 2:37 pm

    Hi Arisha,

    I'm so sorry you had to experience that situation today. I'm not sure I can really imagine what that must have felt like. And I'm not going to tell you to be strong, or to hang in there. I understand why people say those things and I'm not criticizing them, but honestly, if you said 'screw this!' and threw your microphone in the nearest trash can and jumped on the first plane for home I would understand completely. I just don't know how you have been able to do what you have been doing. I have tremendous respect and admiration for you.

    I wish we could all be there to support you in situations like this. And I wish we could all be there to celebrate with you and thank you in person in DC.

  • 265. AndrewPDX  |  August 7, 2010 at 2:49 pm

    Wow… Arisha, thank you for tackling Ms. King (after hearing her speak, I cannot believe she believes the honorary title of 'doctor') and her blinded lack of vision.

    It is so sad that the DNA that created the great Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr was somehow involved in her speech; he must be crying in disbelief in how his dream could be so easily corrupted.

    We love you Arisha!


  • 266. Bolt  |  August 7, 2010 at 3:14 pm

    According to one Atlanta news source, the NOMarriage bus tour attracted 12 people. One of them drove in from Alabama.


    This pathetic tour, and the careers of these foolish bigots will crash and burn like the Led Zeppelin.

    The niece of Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. is a KKK, sexist bigot!

  • 267. Louie Louie, oh no (or ho&hellip  |  August 7, 2010 at 4:01 pm

    […] 56 or 80 or 110 (even though in most places, it’s nowhere close to triple digits). Even today in the Deep South, Georgia, a state that voted for a constitutional ban by a 3-1 margin, the count […]

  • 268. Lora  |  August 7, 2010 at 4:32 pm

    Did anyone hear her answer a single question that Arisha asked her?? I didn't.

    And for all of her babble about no races…just the human race…why does she have "africanamerican" in her website link??

    I, too, would like to thanks Arisha and all those covering these "rallys" for us all! You're all heros!

  • 269. Truth Wins Out - Alveda K&hellip  |  August 7, 2010 at 5:09 pm

    […] at a rally for a hate group like the National Organization for Marriage.  The Courage Campaign points out that today’s crowd, in the city of Atlanta, which is ringed by suburbs full of conservative […]

  • 270. Roger  |  August 7, 2010 at 5:10 pm

    In fact she doesn't share MLK's genes. She and he share genes from their common ancestors, that is MLK's parents. And being a generation further along, she has half as many of those as he did.

    Had she said she shares DNA with with MLK, that would have been accurate — but it doesn't prove anything. For as good an example as any, look at Beethoven's dunderhead nephew Karl van Beethoven.

    Or if you prefer, at the endless numbers of princes who didn't inherit their fathers' skills and ruled badly. That is one of the most cogent arguments against a hereditary aristocracy, something that Americans (with the conspicuous exceptions of families like the Bushes and, it seems, the Kings) rejected when they became independent.

  • 271. GMCarter  |  August 7, 2010 at 8:27 pm

    It's just a darn good thing them homos ain't part of the hooman race, godless, childless demons that they are.

    (Actually, I DO agree with her that race as a notion is pernicious; I think she is right on there.)

    But frankly, I think if god were around she'd say "WAIT STOP! Look, I know I said go out and be fruitful but ENOUGH ALREADY. Jesus Christ, go out and be Fruit now….you're eating up the planet!

  • 272. Steve  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:26 pm

    At least he admits that "traditional marriage" is something very different from what the anti-gay groups sell it as.

  • 273. bJason  |  August 7, 2010 at 9:48 pm

    Mine is Zip Robinhood – no kidding!

  • 274. Sagesse  |  August 7, 2010 at 10:51 pm


    NOM and co. not only use the stereotype of the 'traditional family', their position implies this family structure is still 'the norm'. They are protecting 'the people' whose families mostly all benefit from this singularly valuable (and blessed) family structure. It is an abuse of statitistics, yes, but it is fundamentally (pun intended) one of their lies of vast oversimplification.

    Disclosure: Single parent for twenty years. My son is well adjusted, never been in any trouble, doesn't even use legal drugs (he gave up coffee last month, his idea, not mine), a 25 year old college graduate, productive member of society.

  • 275. rf  |  August 7, 2010 at 11:11 pm

    " if you’re a bigoted asshole who thinks that the only “real” family is Ozzie and Harriet"…

    I must have missed the episode where Harriet had a baby out of wedlock, married a man of Hindu decent and, drove around the country speaking her hateful views in public and tv.

  • 276. Billy  |  August 8, 2010 at 2:50 am

    Corky Washington

  • 277. Deanna Bayless  |  August 8, 2010 at 3:14 am

    If she believes equal rights and justice is all up to god, and not the courts or any legal authority, then why even bother marching or speaking about civil rights in the '60s, or speaking to a ginormous crowd of 15 today? Just sit back and wait for things to just magically come to pass, and anything that happens is automatically god's will. And in that case, why is Judge Walker's ruling not considered to be her god's doing?

    And she keeps speaking in the video about how we're all one race, but then turns around and justifies discrimination against gays by saying that the majority of blacks oppose gay marriage. If we're all one race (which we are, BTW), why should it matter what percentage of the people with a particular skin color think? We're all the same, right? You can't have it both ways.

  • 278. Brittney  |  August 8, 2010 at 3:45 am

    Oh I'll definately be keeping up with the site!
    I enjoy watching footage of the Nombies and Brian and his inability to answer questions. lol.
    I wish I could make it to the tampa event, but I live too far from Florida :( And I have to work *sigh*
    But I do hope there will be another Atlanta event one day soon…

  • 279. Mackenzie  |  August 8, 2010 at 5:40 am

    just got around to watching the vid….this lady seems sweet, but lacks a lot of understanding, at least that is my feeling. Her since of pride that she is somehow more of Dr. King than his late wife also kind of turned me off. What really got me at the end is her comment that a majority of blacks today do vote that marriage is between one man and one woman and that is somehow in no way representative of the race equality issue she was fighting for not too long ago, makes me sad. I hope her conversation with Arisha will cause her to go back and reflect on what she believes. If we are all one human race meant to love one another, then my question to Dr. Alveda King is, where is the love?

  • 280. Luke Robuck  |  August 8, 2010 at 6:05 am

    The best part of yesterday's rally was rocking out & dancing with the equality supporters while NOM played the unity song. They were still the whole song. We had a lot of fun with it. Cars repeatedly drove by and honked in our support, followed by hollers of approval on our side. It was a nice addition. Great day. 😀

  • 281. BradK  |  August 8, 2010 at 7:20 am

    …the endless numbers of princes who didn’t inherit their fathers’ skills and ruled badly…


  • 282. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 8, 2010 at 8:01 am

    And they actuallyl quoted Brian as saying marriage makes us MORE human. And then they wonder why denying marriage equality is yet another form of bigotry. Or am I wrong in thinking that part of bigotry involves the dehumanization of a class of people that you don't like?

  • 283. BradK  |  August 8, 2010 at 8:13 am

    ..crash and burn like the Led Zeppelin….

  • 284. marcus  |  August 8, 2010 at 8:50 am

    :-( I'm a country boy. Mine is "Snoopy County Road 36."

  • 285. marcus  |  August 8, 2010 at 8:59 am

    Nothing easier. Here it is. She basically threatened a curse on her entire family, goes on about the extinction of the human race due to gay marriage, and then copies some rather quaint chapters from a few favorite books…

  • 286. marcus  |  August 8, 2010 at 9:06 am

    @Lightning Baltimore…. I think the line you're looking for comes from none other than the darling of the hard right on this issue, Dr. Paul Cameron:

    “If you isolate sexuality as something solely for one’s own personal amusement, and all you want is the most satisfying orgasm you can get—and that is what homosexuality seems to be—then homosexuality seems too powerful to resist. The evidence is that men do a better job on men, and women on women if all you are looking for is an orgasm . . . Marital sex tends toward the boring end. Generally, it doesn’t deliver the kind of sheer sexual pleasure that homosexual sex does.” – Rolling Stone, March, 18, 1999

  • 287. marcus  |  August 8, 2010 at 9:15 am

    So, here's the right's criticism about Walker — "a gay judge might benefit from gay marriage, so he should recuse himself from the case. We should have had a straight judge"

    Here's their case against gay marriage — "gay marriage will harm the institution of marriage, which is, by definition, a straight institution."

    Thus, it follows that a straight person might suffer harm from the legalization of gay marriage, right? Why again is a straight judge more objective than a gay judge?

    Ironically, if they weren't so over the top about how much harm straights would suffer from gay marriage, their case against Walker would hold more water…

  • 288. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 8, 2010 at 10:03 am

    It would also hold more water if they would stop relying on the speculation of a newspaper article about Judge Walker's orientation, which he himself has never stated. Until the time that Judge Walker says one way or the other what his orientation is, all talk about it is nothing more than speculation and supposition.

  • 289. NOM in Orlando: Another r&hellip  |  August 8, 2010 at 12:12 pm

    […] the epic #NOMTurnoutFAIL in Atlanta yesterday, where just sixteen (yes, 16) NOM supporters showed up (on a Saturday, to boot) to hear Alveda […]

  • 290. Lightning Baltimore  |  August 8, 2010 at 2:15 pm

    I'm pretty sure this was a recent comment, not something from Dr. Slimeball. It makes my blood boil that his fake statistics still get used to this day to defame us, despite being refuted again-and-again-and-again.

  • 291. Box Turtle Bulletin &raqu&hellip  |  August 8, 2010 at 3:33 pm

    […] drew their smallest crowd to date. (Tour Tracker) We see that Dr. Alveda King has made it. She’s joined by only about 16 NOM supporters (Louis […]

  • 292. Meet the Trackers, Part 3&hellip  |  August 8, 2010 at 7:00 pm

    […] Hatch. (If you haven’t read yesterday’s post about the Atlanta NOM event in which Arisha conducted an interview with Alveda King, niece of MLK, read it and watch the video now to understand Arisha’s approach to her […]

  • 293. Paul in Canada  |  August 9, 2010 at 3:08 am

    This women is a whackadoodle nut-job liar! Her granddaddy would be appalled!

    Shame on this religiously-blind, ignoramous.

  • 294. More Bigotry from FL Gube&hellip  |  August 10, 2010 at 9:19 am

    […] More Bigotry from FL Gubernatorial Candidate McCollum August 10, 2010 tags: Gay Rights, Parenting, foster care, Florida, adoption, Bill McCollum by nseaver I wrote a few weeks ago about Florida’s Attorney General and candidate for Governor Bill McCollum and his stand to ban allowing gay parents to adopt.  Now, he wants to ban gay couples from providing foster care.  But here’s what kills me: in this attack on gay families, he also attacks single parents.  This isn’t the first time that single parents are called inferior.  Any claim that you need both a mother and father is insulting to millions of divorced and widowed families, and its a common refrain among conservatives who oppose marriage equality (even claiming kids of single parents are times more likely to commit a crime). […]

  • 295. Reflections on race, cour&hellip  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:03 pm

    […] I agree with her, but I understand Alveda King (or those of you who missed my discussion with her in Atlanta, the video is below). Because for all the judges and elected officials who have stood up for […]

  • 296. What drives many of NOM&#&hellip  |  August 13, 2010 at 7:16 am

    […] “evidence” that physical abuse of children is much higher with same-sex couples, or citing how children growing up without a mother and father are 20 times more likely to commit violent […]

  • 297. NOM in Orlando: Another r&hellip  |  September 28, 2010 at 7:32 am

    […] the epic #NOMTurnoutFAIL in Atlanta yesterday, where just sixteen (yes, 16) NOM supporters showed up (on a Saturday, to boot) to hear Alveda […]

  • 298. car repair insurance&hellip  |  May 11, 2011 at 12:20 pm

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  • 300. Louis Marinelli’s S&hellip  |  July 5, 2011 at 9:03 pm

    […] the last tour stops added to the itinerary was Atlanta and I bring this site up because it was in Atlanta that I can remember that I questioned what I was doing for the first time. The NOM showing in the […]

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