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NOM’s Brian Brown, the truth, and the distance between the two

NOM Tour Tracker Right-wing

by Arisha Michelle Hatch

After wading through 255 equality activists and 61 NOM supporters, I arrived at the from of the “One Man, One Woman” rally in Raleigh just in time to hear Brian Brown describe my interview with Dr. Alveda King as a “meltdown.”

NOM supporters in Raleigh, NC

Two minutes after his speech ended I approached Brown with my Flipcam.

“Did you just say I had a meltdown?”


It’s clear to me after four weeks that Brown’s knee-jerk reaction is to lie.

“Maybe I should have used a different word,” Brown stuttered 20 seconds later. I thought “she touched your heart.”

Is that what you really think, Brian, or is that a lie too?

Mary Forrester, a representative for Concerned Women for America (and wife to a NC state senator) is speaking now.

Equality supporters in Raleigh, NC
Equality supporters across the street from NOM’s rally

UPDATE BY ARISHA (10:41 PST): Pastor Olden Thornton just asked NOM supporters to face the counter-protesters across the street and join him in a prayer. The 60 or so attendees turned holding their arms in the air.

“We love you.  We love you,” he repeated to close his prayer.

UPDATE BY ADAM (10:56 PST): Some more photos in from Raleigh, courtesy of Phyllis:

Young equality supporters in Raleigh

Creative signs in support of equality in Raleigh

More equality supporters in Raleigh

UPDATE BY ADAM (12:41 PST): In what appears to be another reference to Arisha’s interview with Alveda King in Atlanta, here’s Brian Brown again (via NOM’s blog):

Brian Brown urged supporters this afternoon to stand and urge their legislators to support a constitutional amendment to protect marriage: “If you move forward with a marriage amendment in North Carolina, you will show the government where we stand.” The way will not always be easy, however: “In Atlanta, some attempted to attack Dr. Alveda King and smear her — she greeted it with love.”

UPDATE BY ADAM (1:56 PST): The inimitable Pam Spaulding from Pam’s House Blend!:

Pam Spaulding in Raleigh, NC]


Contrast that with the Kiekegard family:

I’d like Joann to meet the Kiekgards. Those don’t exactly look like “unhappy children” out on the streets.


  • 1. Lesbians Love Boies  |  August 10, 2010 at 3:48 am


  • 2. Ann S.  |  August 10, 2010 at 3:50 am

    We love YOU, Arisha.

  • 3. Ronnie  |  August 10, 2010 at 3:50 am

    Brainless Brown Suit…..can't handle the truth….<3…Ronnie

  • 4. Carolyn  |  August 10, 2010 at 3:51 am

    "We love you. We love you," they said.

    What they didn't say: "But we don't want you to love each other."

  • 5. Ķĭŗîļĺę&  |  August 10, 2010 at 3:51 am

    Writing a report right now from Papa Foma and Felyx.

  • 6. Kathleen  |  August 10, 2010 at 3:55 am

    Subscribing.. because I'm almost caught up with email and we can't have THAT.

  • 7. Christoph  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:01 am

    "We love you—we love you"


  • 8. Ķĭŗîļĺę&  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:01 am


    Papa Foma just got back home with a report. He says by his estimates, NOMers had at most 60 people, including staff. Equality side had somewhere from 120 to 250 people (different estimates from different sources).

    The rally was held at the South side of the NC Capitol building; the counter-protesters were just across the street, on the corner in the shadow, shielded from the sun, and there was water available for everyone. One very tall man was standing there with a “Free hugs” sing on his t-shirt (he hugged Papa Foma).

    Many people came with equality signs, in rainbow colors. Equality North Carolina that did not want to participate in the counter-protest at first, joined the equality side at the last minute. There was also the minister and other clergymen and church members of The Church Of Christ (President Obama is the member of that Church).

    Equality supporters were polite and friendly, though a bit loud (there were complaints from NOM supporters that they couldn't hear the speakers). Several counter-protesters accidentally wandered on the rally side and were politely, without any conflicts, asked by the police to get back across the street.

    Equality rally was a lot of fun. People were chanting, “Get your hate out of our state!” But mostly you could hear the famous “What do you want? — Equality! — When do you want it? — Now!

    Felyx promises his sign was captured by many media reporters (I'll keep it a secret for now what was on it). Pictures and videos personally made by Felyx and Papa Foma will be made available later. Right now Felyx and some new friends of his are celebrating.

    — ♂KF

  • 9. Lesbians Love Boies  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:02 am

    Great comeback Carolyn!

  • 10. AndrewPDX  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:03 am

    <cite>“We love you.  We love you,” he repeated to close his prayer.</cite>

    I would have yelled back PROVE IT!!!

    Actions speak louder than words, even when those words are prayers.

    Liberté, Égalité, Fraternité

  • 11. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:07 am

    If they really love me, they will let me marry my husband legally & have it recognized.

  • 12. Alan E.  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:08 am

    Apparenty the mountain of real work is just not as important

  • 13. Ann S.  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:12 am

    In other news: The American Bar Association and the National Education Association have both, within the past week, passed resolutions endorsing marriage equality.

    Gays and lesbians should have the right to marry in civil ceremonies, the ABA’s policy-making House of Delegates declared on Tuesday. The measure passed on a voice vote.

    A lineup of ABA leaders, both past and present, spoke in favor of the resolution. Incoming ABA President Stephen Zack asked “Why would anyone in this country not want two people who love each other to enjoy the blessings of marriage and the protections of law?”

    Former ABA President Tommy Wells told the House that “our citizens of the same sex who are being denied the right to a civil marriage are only seeking to participate in an equal basis in a foundational institution of our civil life. They simply want to share in the legal blessings that we give to married couples. It can only strengthen marriage.”

  • 14. Sagesse  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:12 am

    On the road again….

  • 15. Lesbians Love Boies  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:13 am

    Pro-equality counter-protesters outnumber anti-gay NOM rally attendees in Raleigh

    Great picture qnotes!

  • 16. fiona64  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:14 am

    This. In spades.

    Shalom, Richard and BZ! I can't wait to read about your experiences.


  • 17. AndrewPDX  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:16 am

    Great… Now I'm gonna have Willie Nelson stuck in my head.

    Liberté, Égalité, Fraternité

  • 18. Dave P.  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:18 am

    "We love you. We love you."


  • 19. Sagesse  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:19 am

    There are times in all kinds of relationships when the person saying "I/we love you" is not talking about the 'you' in question; they're expressing how good the gesture feels for them. 'Look at me, I'm so kind and generous.'

  • 20. Kathleen  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:20 am

    Yay Twitter user Kirille :)

    I see Brian is recycling his excuses for the poor turnout.

  • 21. fiona64  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:21 am

    Yes. "We love you … for looking at us while we pray for you to be more like us."


  • 22. Dave P.  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:21 am

    Bah! That site is blocked overe here at work. : |

  • 23. Sagesse  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:22 am

    Why can't we share the pain:)? No idea where it came from, and now that dratted song won't go away.

  • 24. Dave P.  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:23 am

    Thanks Kirillie! I'm so glad to hear that we had so much support from the good folks in Raleigh. Can't wait to see the video & pictures!

  • 25. fiona64  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:23 am

    That's pretty rich, frankly, coming from a guy whose "job" is to drive around the country in a bus promoting bigotry …

    I guess the idea that his message fails to resonate even in conservative towns, such that no one is willing to spend their lunch break listening to him spew, has not yet occurred to him.

    Brian and Louis, the above paragraph is for you.


  • 26. bJason  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:24 am

    I have felt that way since early January! :)

  • 27. Polydactyl  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:29 am


    Last I checked there was nothing "loving" about denying someone the right/ability to visit their family in the hospital, to acquire a visa to be with their fiancee, to fully and legally protect their children…

  • 28. Apricot  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:29 am

    I'm actually a bit disappointed in Raleigh. Sixty NOM guys? Really? Raleigh NC was outdone by Atlanta Georgia?

    Didn't get a chance to come but I'll be kicking myself forever for not being there protesting with you guys.

  • 29. Straight Grandmother  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:31 am

    Don't you love the sign, "People of Quality don't fear Equality"

    Man that there is a great sign.

  • 30. Anonygrl  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:32 am

    We love you! We love you!


  • 31. Ann S.  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:33 am

    That's right, it's just good business! LOL

    Actually, on a more serious note, as I imagine you are aware (but you felt the irresistible pull of the op for a lawyer joke), it is far more expensive in legal fees to get through private contracts just some of the same protections married couples have.

    Another form of inequality that opponents like to gloss over.

  • 32. Anonygrl  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:35 am

    THAT's ok… at this point, as long as they are on my side and the reasoning isn't EVIL, I will take it!

  • 33. Tigger  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:36 am

    Judge Walker's ruling is going to give a lot of ammo to fair minded pro-equality folks to come out in favor of marriage equality who may have been unsure or on the fence.

    Look for more organizations to come out in favor of marriage equality in full force!!

  • 34. Straight Grandmother  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:37 am

    I think this is great "other news" Do you think the tide is turning? The ABA and the teachers come out now with a pro Marriage Equality policy. This has never happened before.

    It might be real, maybe we really are witnessing history in the making. I almost hate to hope so much in order to not be disapointed. Could 2010 be THE year?

  • 35. StraightForEquality  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:37 am


  • 36. Straight Grandmother  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:41 am

    @Kevyn, thank you so much for doing this report for all of us. I have been waiting and waiting to see what happened. Yeah! North Carolina did not let them outnumber Equality supporters.

  • 37. Straight Grandmother  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:43 am

    I hope so Tigger, especially I hope our President would join us, it would mean so much.

  • 38. James in Hollywood  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:44 am

    Thank you Raleigh equality supporters! You are wonderful people.

  • 39. Straight Grandmother  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:46 am

    LLB, on the link you provided did you read the comments?

  • 40. Ann S.  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:47 am

    I certainly hope the tide is turning, but we shall see.

  • 41. Felyx  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:48 am

    Here we are the post rally party chillin out at a local restaurant with three of the five organizers! The tracker crew were going to join us but got a surprise last minute interview.

    Richard and BZ are with us now. He says to stay tuned for the interview that Phyllis had with them. BZ is the pretty one… according to BZ! 😛

    The post-rally group gives a shout out to all the P8TTers out there! We are all united in solidartity.

    Timothy from the group says, "We have won a major battle! (Winning Prop 8)"

    Lee from the group says, "Jeffrey my deceased spouse would have been proud that I finally joined in!"

    From us all here we love you and can't wait to celebrate in victory!!!

    Felyx and Kevyn from Raleigh (and Russia)

  • 42. Apricot  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:49 am

    Well that's my point. There were more NOM guys in Raleigh than in Atlanta – IE there seems to be more anti-equality folks in Raleigh and I kind of figured there would be just as much if not less than the Atlanta turnout – thus I was disappointed.

    Still though, the some 200 protesters isn't something to scoff at either.

  • 43. Rebecca  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:50 am

    I feel the same as you on this one! For all that I have tried to be skeptical about our chances and not get my hopes up, I'm starting to get tingly. It really is beginning to feel like THE year where equality finally takes a big step forward.

    We are proving every step of the way that we are on the right side of history, and now other groups are recognizing that and joining us!

  • 44. Kathleen  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:51 am

    We love you, too. Shout out to the Trackers and organizers and all the other supporters there with you. BIG HUGS to ALL.

  • 45. sister rachel  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:53 am

    if pastor thorton's concept love is anything like that of many anti-equlaity christians, i imagine it is rooted in the fundamentally flawed concept of loving a sinner while hating his sin. except, of course, this supposes that families wanting to be together to support one another (a pretty important christian value, last time i checked) are sinning.

    (um, they're not)

    the unfortunate thing about pastor thorton declaring his love for the counter-protesters is that, within his paradigm, he DOES love them. but his concept of christian love is so warped that he believes this paternalistic-theocentric-half-hearted pity he's feeling and expressing is the same as the love Jesus Christ had for all people (even ACTUAL sinners) and taught us to have for one another.

    his inability to understand the difference makes me so sad.


    sister rachel

  • 46. AndrewPDX  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:54 am

    Hmm… "Raleigh Rally"… Is it just my accent, or is that a homophonic phrase?

    Liberté, Égalité, Fraternité

  • 47. Linda  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:55 am

    As a public school teacher, it is incredibly reassuring to see that the NEA has come out IN SUPPORT of SSM!

  • 48. Rebecca  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:57 am

    Whoa! Big news! Boies himself said it would be important to have the backing of the ABA. One by one, the excuses that could be given for discrimination are being disproved and removed.

  • 49. ralzma  |  August 10, 2010 at 4:59 am

    Yes it is. A nice little internal rhyme, it's easy to remember, and it really sticks. One of the first ones I noticed.

  • 50. Anonygrl  |  August 10, 2010 at 5:02 am

    So… the NOM Raleigh Rally is homophonic homophobia?

    Tee hee… I made MYSELF giggle at that.

    OT, is anyone looking out for the ruling on the stay?

  • 51. Anna Bryan  |  August 10, 2010 at 5:03 am

    I think due to the location, in downtown Raleigh, during lunch, on a workday, you would get more people. The capital building is in the heart of the office district.

    The people in Atlanta had to make a decision to drive downtown on a weekend.

    I think it shows more about how much people actually want to "protect" marriage. They aren't willing to take time to drive to do it…

  • 52. Alan E.  |  August 10, 2010 at 5:04 am

    I had to read it a few times to see how it was homophobic. Then I realized the error of my ways.

  • 53. Alan E.  |  August 10, 2010 at 5:05 am

    What the heck? I specifically responded to the "homophonic post"

  • 54. Kathleen  |  August 10, 2010 at 5:06 am

    I'm watching. Nothing has been e-filed yet. Unfortunately, I'm going to the dentist later today, so hoping if it is today, it's before 3:30.

  • 55. Anonygrl  |  August 10, 2010 at 5:07 am

    I should have guessed you were! :)

  • 56. Kathleen  |  August 10, 2010 at 5:08 am

    Andrew, it might be our accent. I think the locals pronounce the first syllable in Raleigh like Ball w/ an R. I'm sure they'll correct me if I'm wrong.

  • 57. Anna Bryan  |  August 10, 2010 at 5:08 am

    The next time they try to pray the gay away, I think the counter protesters should pray back. Pray for them to stop trying to harm gays and lesbians. Pray that they start acting like Jesus and stop judging others. Pray that their sons and daughters will not have to face hate and discrimination. Pray that they will stop using the laws of our country to force their religious views on others. Pray that they will start treating their fellow citizens with love and respect.

  • 58. RebeccaRGB  |  August 10, 2010 at 5:11 am

    I pronounce it ɹali ɹæli – not homophonic, but close.

  • 59. Ann S.  |  August 10, 2010 at 5:12 am

    @Linda, I'm having a hard time finding a link except on wingnut websites decrying the NEA's decision, except for this one:

  • 60. Kathleen  |  August 10, 2010 at 5:12 am

    Anna, seems your twitter account is still suspended? Btw, if you're on facebook on a page other than "Anna Bryan" would welcome a friend request (let me know who you are when you send the request. My name in the post links to my fb account.

  • 61. Ann S.  |  August 10, 2010 at 5:13 am

    Boies, fresh off last Wednesday's victory, had already been scheduled to speak at the Commonwealth Club last Thursday as we read about earlier AND to give a keynote address at the annual ABA meeting in San Francisco this past weekend.

    Timing is everything.

  • 62. Sagesse  |  August 10, 2010 at 5:15 am

    SG, others can correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the ABA filed amicus briefs in favour of marriage equality in both the Prop 8 trial and the DOMA trial(s) in Massachusetts. This vote just ratified their support as an 'official' position.

  • 63. Ronnie  |  August 10, 2010 at 5:15 am

    In honor of NOM's FAIL in Raleigh, North Carolina.

    "I'll always remember it was late afternoon. It lasted forever, but ended so soon. You were all by yourself staring up at a dark gray sky. I was changed….

    In places no one will find, all your feelings so deep inside (deep inside). It was there that I realized that forever was in your eyes. The moment I saw you cry"

    This is "Cry" from Mandy Moore for the Movie based on the Book, "A Walk to Remember" by Nicholas Sparks. The story is about a young couple who marry for LOVE, not for religious reasons or to "procreate" (do a shot)….I highly recommend both the book & the Movie (starring Mandy Moore & Shane West)….<3…Ronnie:

  • 64. ns  |  August 10, 2010 at 5:17 am

    a FOX news opinion column promoting marriage equality, on the grounds that by not doing so they'd lose too many voters. Show them your love, folks.

    You can try to stop the paradise we're dreamin' of
    But you cannot stop the rhythm of two hearts in love
    to stay-aaay
    Cause you cantt stop the beat!

  • 65. Kathleen  |  August 10, 2010 at 5:20 am

    I didn't realize, when I read this yesterday, that Margaret Hoover is part of the Advisory Board for AFER:

  • 66. Gary  |  August 10, 2010 at 5:21 am

    I hope someone has him on video in the lie.. what a TOOL !

    WE Love you.. and thank you for all your hard work…

    If you have him in the lie.. just dub a tape with it repeating 100 times..


  • 67. mjd  |  August 10, 2010 at 5:23 am

    Off-topic, but does anyone know if the stay ruling is going to be released today with certainty?

  • 68. Straight Grandmother  |  August 10, 2010 at 5:27 am


    Hello Brian Brown the Bigot! Yes I read the 4 web page interview you gave to the Washington Post where you mentioned that you hate it when people call you a Bigot. So here ya go Buddy, you are not only a Bigot you are perhaps one of the Biggest Bigots int he United States.

    Hello Louis! Ha ha ha, another big #NOM FAIL! You are being humiliated city by city, he-he-he.

    Hello Maggie the H8ter in Chief! You are going down down down, you are going to soon be unemloyed. Look at your Rally numbers, pathetic. Another huge #NOM FAIL. If you go to the Appellet Court make sure and wear your shoes.

  • 69. Timothy Kincaid  |  August 10, 2010 at 5:28 am

    Don't you know?

    "Loving you" means deciding what is best for you and forcing you to do it.

    To anti-gay activists, gay people are like small children, incapable of making the decision that are best for their lives.

  • 70. Jen-Bunny  |  August 10, 2010 at 5:37 am

    I jsut have to say that I feel like I'm part of a community when I read these articles and comments. I have friends all over the country. We are all fighting for the same thing: Equality. I can't wait to call my girlfriend my wife. <3 I love all you guys and gals!!!!

    ~Jen from NorCal

  • 71. Bob Miller  |  August 10, 2010 at 5:43 am

    Great comment! Is their yelling we love you like teen age girls yelling the same thing at, say, Justin Bieber or any teen idol?
    Or is it like the use of "well, bless her / his heart…" a way of saying some one is stupid / dumb or what ever, but as long as you say that, it is okay to say it.

  • 72. fiona64  |  August 10, 2010 at 5:45 am

    We love all of you, too!

    Big hugs!


  • 73. Alexa Valavanis  |  August 10, 2010 at 5:45 am

    What's In a Name?

    Editorial on Prop 8.

  • 74. Kathleen  |  August 10, 2010 at 5:46 am

    Hi Jen-Bunny!

  • 75. Kathleen  |  August 10, 2010 at 5:49 am


  • 76. Kathleen  |  August 10, 2010 at 5:50 am

    Alexa, I only just put it together that YOU wrote the article. It was one of those tear-inducing moments reading it. THANK YOU. It is a wonderful piece.

  • 77. Ann S.  |  August 10, 2010 at 5:51 am

    Wow, I didn't make the connection, either that it was you who wrote it.


  • 78. MJFargo  |  August 10, 2010 at 5:52 am

    One of the hazatrds of being "profiled" here is that we get to know the Equality team in a way that may feel "intimate" on a commenters side, and the subject, Arisha Michelle Hatch, for instance, doesn't know me from Adam. But her interview with Dr. Alveda King was so profound a meeting of respect that was betrayed, all of us who saw the interview–including Brian Brown–were deeply moved. We can all put our own "spin" on what occurred during those moments, but fortunately, we have "the tape" to refer to. Dr. Alveda King did not answer–forthrightly–any of the questions Arisha Michelle Hatch posed. And Ms. Hatch's persistence was admirable. And too, we have all of the interviews with Mr. Brown and Ms. Gallagher and many, many others collected by the Equality team that are important documents, both in the content and in their dignity thanks to the Equality team. During the 1960's we had the Freedom Riders who did the same courageous work, and I'm thankful today we can document what is occuring with video.

  • 79. Straight Grandmother  |  August 10, 2010 at 5:54 am

    The website won't load the page, perhaps it is overloaded.

  • 80. Lesbians Love Boies  |  August 10, 2010 at 5:58 am

    That's a shocker Kathleen!

  • 81. Tony Douglass in Ca  |  August 10, 2010 at 5:59 am

    <cite>Brian Brown urged supporters this afternoon to stand and urge their legislators to support a constitutional amendment to protect marriage: “If you move forward with a marriage amendment in North Carolina, you will show the government where we stand.” The way will not always be easy, however: “In Atlanta, some attempted to attack Dr. Alveda King and smear her — she greeted it with love.”</cite>
    More LIES from BS Brown!! He can say anything he wants on his blog because that's FREE SPEECH, you know, a Constitutional RIGHT!

    If he was in Judge Walker's court, he would have to PROVE that innuendo with FACTS, something he doesn't feel he needs to do!

    Hi Brian…..#FAIL!!

  • 82. Lesbians Love Boies  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:02 am

    Oh, that's a funny picture you just posed in my head…

    Brian Brown in the witness chair being cross examined by David Boies…


  • 83. Jen-Bunny  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:04 am

    Hi Kathleen!!!! =)

  • 84. Ed  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:10 am

    Off topic, but i was just thinking…..
    It's all about "protect the children"…..
    But, Doesn't California (and most states) allow gay couples to adopt, even without civil marriage?
    Why aren't the going after those laws?
    (I know some groups do, but we are talking about NOM here….)

    To quote Sophia (Golden Girls…..yes, I am *that* gay)
    'Well, there's a fly in the metamucil….'
    (sorry, sarcasm doesn't come across on screen as well as if it's spoken.)


  • 85. Ann S.  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:11 am

    They will, if given half a chance.

  • 86. Ann S.  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:12 am

    They'll go after civil unions and domestic partnerships, too, given the chance. They won't rest until all rights are taken away, in their world.

  • 87. Alan E.  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:15 am

    Check out this video (via Joe.My.God.) that compares messages that NOM's followers actually support to the supporters of gender neutral marriages.

    [youtube =]

  • 88. Bill  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:15 am

    Here is Brain Brown's latest 'article' just posted a few minutes ago.

    It is titled, "Judge Walker’s slurs and fantasies will be overruled."

    Have at it, kids. It's a doozy.

  • 89. Anonygrl  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:18 am

    A co-worker just walked by and wondered why I was crying.

    That is beautiful. Words for ALL of us to live by. Thank you.

  • 90. Alan E.  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:19 am

    Ugg he quoted Rush Limbaugh.

  • 91. adambink  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:21 am


    Hugs appreciated.

  • 92. Bill  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:21 am

    If you will pay special attention to the last paragraph, you will note he is laying the groundwork for a Constitutional Amendment against LGBT citizens. It's a subtle-ish statement, but his 'call to Congress' is clearly to incite them to start this process.

    Totally expected, but also totally discouraging that these folks have the arrogance to do this.

  • 93. Lesbians Love Boies  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:21 am

    lol I don't think Brian actually read it before he posted it as his own writing…either that or I have given him false credit for being somewhat smart.

  • 94. rf  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:24 am

    he better watch it, he's linking to the ruling and someone who follows his filth might actually read it.

  • 95. Anonygrl  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:25 am

    He's delusional, all right!

    I wonder if we could get him committed on the grounds that he is a danger to himself and others? I think proving he is a danger to US would be a walk in the park.

  • 96. Felyx  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:27 am

    Hey everyone at P8TT. Just got home to decompress. Unlike the many thousands of phantom NOM supporters who have jobs and can't show up, I am a full time care-taker so we have been switching off (Thom, the neighbor, the ancillary healthcare team) taking care of our gay elder.

    I am currently downloading the camera with our pictures. I am sorry I missed some of the best pics like the pathetic 'Straight Pride' sign that I am sure most of our straight allies would cringe at (not for lack of self-pride but for lack of Fabulousness!) I miss the creepy Pseudo-Nazi prayer salute and the 'Marriage is a Rite; not a Right' as well.

    The woman holding the last sign got an interview… so much for NOM doing damage control!

    Hope to have the pics out soon on Flickr with commentary!


  • 97. Straight Grandmother  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:28 am

    No, all states and even I bet most states, do not permit 2 same sex persons to co adopt/or co parent children born to one of the adults with a sperm or egg donor. In other words both adults are both the legal parent.

    Some states will allow only one person in the couple to adopt but not both. Virginia, Arkansas, Florida and I think Texas (not sure) come to mind as being very restrictive. If I have a chance I'll look it up and come back. I am sure you know the story of my grandchildren by now so I won't repeat it.

  • 98. l8r_g8r  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:30 am

    Interesting that they think we're like children.

    Matthew 18:1-4

    At that time the disciples came to Jesus, saying, “Who is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven?” And calling to him a child, he put him in the midst of them and said, “Truly, I say to you, unless you turn and become like children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven. Whoever humbles himself like this child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven. “Whoever receives one such child in my name receives me…"

  • 99. Kathleen  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:30 am

    Well, to his credit, he links directly to a PDF of the decision. Maybe some people will actually read it (and not just the FoF 77 that Brian mentions).

    Is it just my perception that's shifting, or are Brian's writings becoming more shrill, whiny and irrational than they used to be?

  • 100. Lightning Baltimore  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:37 am

    Do you have a link? I searched their site with no luck.


    Thanks in advance!

  • 101. Bill  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:38 am

    You are correct, Kathleen.

    His desperation is visible.

  • 102. James Tuttle  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:38 am

    I am too. I have all the seasons on DVD and watch…*sometimes* Golden Girls makes a bad day better.

  • 103. sister rachel  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:39 am

    brother brown needs to fire his copy editor. that was painful and NOT just from an equality standpoint!


    sister rachel

  • 104. Sagesse  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:40 am

    "There is no shortage of evidence, scholarly and otherwise, that marriage has deep roots in true and enduring differences between same-sex and opposite-sex couples. Law Prof. Nelson Lund is only repeating the obvious when he wrote in this Sunday’s San Francisco Chronicle:

    Only unions between men and women are capable of producing offspring, and every civilization has recognized that responsible procreation is critical to its survival…The fundamental purpose of marriage is to encourage biological parents, especially fathers, to take responsibility for their children. Because this institution responds to a phenomenon uniquely created by heterosexual intercourse, the meaning of marriage has always been inseparable from the problem it addresses."

    Did I miss the part where Nelson Lund testified for the Prop 8 proponents?

  • 105. Linda  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:41 am

    I know, we can have a pray off! They can 'pray the gay away', and we can 'pray the gay will stay'…and we'll see which side God is on by who's prayer he answers!!!

  • 106. sister rachel  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:42 am

    oh, i'm professor lund wanted very much to testify but just couldn't, what with all those pesky death threats he no doubt received…


    sister rachel

  • 107. Kathleen  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:42 am

    I think Brian is losing his veneer of civility.

  • 108. Straight Ally #3008  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:43 am

    “We love you. We love you,” he repeated to close his prayer.

    Is that a bit like "Bless your heart" when you mean "FU?"

    Actually, that's too harsh. You have to figure that most of these people think that being gay is a choice, so of course they just want them to give up their sinful/harmful lifestyle because they think it's for their own good. I know we debate why choice vs. not a choice matters here, this is one practical aspect of it, I think.

  • 109. Kathleen  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:45 am

    "The witness box is a lonely place" ~ David Boies

  • 110. Linda  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:47 am

    BS Brown can say anything he wants about previous rallies, because no one from his side attends the rallies, so there's no one to contradict him! He's free to make up as many lies and accusations as he wants!

    The good news is that the number of people willing to listen to and believe his lies is getting smaller and smaller.

  • 111. Straight Grandmother  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:48 am

    Bill, Whoa BS Brown, the biggest Bigot in the United States, is becoming unglued, he is off the wall. He has literally "lost it" In fact if you go look at finding of fact #77 as he asks in his article you will see that the very first piece of evidence Judge walker relied on is from their own witness, h-ha, how funny is that?

    Yeah Nathanson, their witness who withdrew after being depositioned by Boies, said in Findings of Fact #77 that "religions teach that homosexual relations are a sin and that contributes to gay bashing."

    Is Brian Brown a complete IDIOT for linking to the actual verdict that shows actual, you know, real, evidence that directly contradicts his premis that Judge Walker is off in fantasy land? What a dummy he links to the evidence of the Judges decision.

    I seriously wonder if he is drunk when he writes these tirades. He has got to be drunk, right? What else could it be. He is just NUTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

  • 112. Anna Bryan  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:49 am

    Linda. I LOVE that idea!

  • 113. Alan E.  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:49 am

    Another funny point about Finding of Fact #77 is that it was among the facts that had the highest number of evidence pieces quoted in the ruling: 18 citations.

  • 114. Sagesse  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:50 am

    Well, we asked him to read the facts… which he did, but not the reams of citations for each one. Be careful what we wish for, people :).

    If you're BB or Maggie or a conservative commentator, here's how you read Judge Walker's decision, evidently:

    Read the conclusion, and discern that he doesn't agree with you; repeat your debunked arguments to show how absurdly wrong the decision is.

    Maybe read the findings of law… not sure about that… and assert that the judge doesn't understand and is making a mockery of the Constitution.

    Wait a few days, maybe skim the findings of fact, without delving into the three weeks' worth of evidence that backs them up, and proclaim that the judge made them up.

    Must be the kind of clear critical thinking they teach at Oxford. Sheeesh.

  • 115. Straight Grandmother  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:56 am

    I was going to register at the DailyCaller Website to enter a comment UNTIL I read their privacy policy. Ummmm not with me they are not. This will not doubt be published somewhere else where I can comment.

  • 116. Bill  |  August 10, 2010 at 6:59 am

    My guess is that Brian and Maggie have not even read the ruling.

    Why let something as ridiculous as the fact stand in the way of your mission to harm the human beings you feel you are superior to, right?

    The major difference between NOM and the KKK are the people they think they're better than.

  • 117. Anna Bryan  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:01 am

    It appears 7 states actually ban adoptions by LGBT's while 18 expressly allow it. The remaining are ambiguous.

    Note the 7 number includes Florida, whose ban is currently being challenged and has thus far been found to be unconstitutional.

  • 118. Bill  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:01 am

    I can not believe that 'man' attended Oxford.

    I really can not.

  • 119. Bill  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:08 am

    They don't REALLY think it's a choice.

    But saying it is a choice allows them to conduct themselves in immoral ways that their consciences would not normally allow them to participate in. They must first dehumanize us in order to do that. When the dehumanization is complete, all bets are off. All traces of compassion and humanity – erased.

    We gays, with our 'choices,' bring this all on ourselves, dontcha know!

    And those who truly believe their sexuality is a choice, well, they are clearly bisexual. Because if you have 'a choice' to be attracted to either a male or a female, you are bisexual.

    I couldn't be attracted to any woman. I love you, ladies, but my brain is not wired to be attracted to you physically. I had no say in that. Nor would I change it even if I could. That's what makes me a gay man. If I had some sort of 'choice' in the matter, I'd be bisexual, not gay.

    It seems so simple and yet…

  • 120. Kathleen  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:11 am

    As long as we're all going to speculate… :) My guess is that Brian and Maggie have read the ruling. I also don't think they believe all of their spin. I think they believe their core message – that marriage should be as they define it and that they fear being marginalized in the modern world. But I think much of what they say is the result of understanding who their base of supporters is and what messages play well to that base.

  • 121. Linda  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:11 am

    They 'love' us! Yeah, I've heard about that kind of love. That's the same love that captors have for their victims; they love them so much they HAVE to beat them, torture them, rape them. In fact, the victims are the ones at fault. The victims are the ones that are MAKING them do those dreadful things.

    Yeah, that's love alright. (said with disgust)

  • 122. Susan R Barnes  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:12 am

    Thanks for the lovely article!

  • 123. AndrewPDX  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:13 am

    Oh, I would love to see that!

    Liberté, Égalité, Fraternité

  • 124. Kathleen  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:13 am

    Anna, there may be 7 that ban adoption by lbgt couples, but I thought Florida was the last hold-out for single parent adoptions by g&l's. Not true?

  • 125. Owen  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:17 am

    I'm actually not that surprised. Hoover has been an outspoken proponent of marriage equality for a while now.

  • 126. Straight Grandmother  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:18 am

    @Bill- Honestly I think he was 3 sheets to the wind plastered when he wrote this. It is soooooo off the wall. His references to "waving a magic wand", and "Poof," wait is was "Whoof," it seems to me like he was on a bender and all emotional.

    Just like Maggie reigned in Louis, I bet she is on the phone right now trying to get through and his is probably sleeping it off.

  • 127. Lightning Baltimore  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:19 am


    What a ridiculous "interview." Being called a bigot for working to actively harm other people hurts his feelings? His venear of pleasantness and civility make his divisive aims acceptible? I can't believe the Post ran that piece!

  • 128. Owen  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:20 am

    I think NOM in general has adopted a much more jaded, acidic, and combative tone in recent months. They've been considerably moody since the trial. I think it's a sign of their realization that they will be on the losing side – the wrong side of history – and there's nothing they can do now.

  • 129. Kathleen  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:23 am

    Love the sign in Raleigh – "Dumbledore would be ashamed" LOL

  • 130. Kevin  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:23 am

    Anyone know if we're going to find out if there's a stay or not today?

  • 131. DazedWheels  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:27 am

    Off topic, but a new document has been filed with the Courts:

    NOTICE OF APPEAL as to [709] Order on Motion to Intervene, [708] Order on Motion for Miscellaneous Relief by Board of Supervisors of Imperial County, County of Imperial of the State of California, Isabel Vargas. Filing fee $ 455, Receipt Number 34611049132. (far, COURT STAFF) (Filed on 8/10/2010)

    Don't know what it is yet, though.

  • 132. Straight Grandmother  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:27 am

    Anna that sounds about right to me, only 18 have across the board no problems GLBT adoptions/co-parenting. The "ambigious" states if you dig in I think will show that they do not permit a GLBT couple to be co parents. They will permit for example a single GLBT person to adopt but they will not permit it in a home where two people cohabitate that are not married. So if you are single and want to adopt, no problem. But if you are not single, adios. Which is really crazy if you think about it, the state is then saying we prefer children to be raised in a single head of household, ather than in a home with 2 parents. All it is is discrimination.

    I remember Florida was particularly onerous, Virginia is not a cake walk either.

  • 133. Mandy  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:27 am

    "responsible procreation" since when does civilization think they can control this. Sorry it just made me lmao. Oh and this is coming from a straight married women with 2.5 kids where only one was from responsible procreation.

  • 134. Straight Grandmother  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:29 am

    Alexa, your website must block connections from outside the United States. Boo-Hoo.

  • 135. Kathleen  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:31 am

    UPDATE: Imperial County files Notice of Appeal to 9th Circuit re: their motion to intervene

  • 136. DazedWheels  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:32 am

    Thank you, my friend! :-)

  • 137. Straight Grandmother  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:33 am

    Nice video, I got caught up in the next post and failed to offer props. It is really telling when you see the video.

  • 138. Kathleen  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:33 am

    CORRECTION: This is a notice of appeal re: BOTH their motion to intervene and ALSO appeal of Walker's decision in the case.

  • 139. DazedWheels  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:34 am

    Are those idiots appealing the denial of intervenor status AND the decision? Isn't that a touch "cart before the horse"?

  • 140. DazedWheels  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:34 am

    yep, they're idiots all right.

  • 141. fiona64  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:35 am

    Um, hello? You filed the request *after* the deadline to do so. Do not pass go, do not collect $200.

    Game over.


  • 142. fiona64  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:36 am

    Thank you for the photos, Felyx. :-)


  • 143. fiona64  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:37 am

    Exactly. It allows them to tell a villain story about GLBT people, without recognizing any of their own shortcomings, etc.


  • 144. James Tuttle  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:41 am

    I hate shit like this. Sorry for the course language, but Its so damn irritating. I was hoping that today we would hear Judge Walker's ruling on a stay…and here these fools are mucking it up. I now feel he has to consider their opinion and delay his decision even longer. So…I'm thinking no ruling today.

  • 145. Kathleen  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:43 am

    I don't think this will necessarily have a bearing on Walker's decision. I suspect he'll keep on the same schedule he would have otherwise.

  • 146. Straight Grandmother  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:44 am

    Felyx, I went an dclosely lookeed at every one of your pictures, they are great! LOTS of great signs, and I notice lots of straight ally supporters. I was worried about the attack dogs at the rally though, you know how BS Brown hates attack dogs, LOL!

  • 147. Michael  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:44 am

    Great story, but it inaccurately describes "Dr." Alveda King.

    King does not have a doctorate in anything.

    As Pam's House Blend has pointed out, King has an honorary degree, not a real one.

  • 148. Kathleen  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:45 am

    There were also a number of other filings, but they are all just formal procedural things to do with this notice of appeal, for example, transmission of docket sheet to 9th Circuit — nothing new at all.

  • 149. Anonygrl  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:46 am

    I can see that on a poster.

    "You pray the gay away…
    I'll pray the gay will stay…

    And we'll see whose prayer God answers!"

    VERY good, Linda!!!

  • 150. RebeccaRGB  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:51 am

    It just occurred to me that "responsible procreation" sounds like something out of China.

    You hear that? Nelson Lund wants us to be like COMMUNIST CHINA!

    Hey, if they can play slippery slope with us, we can play slippery slope with them. It's only fair.

  • 151. Ann S.  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:52 am

    I agree (as always!). The filings by Imperial County were anticipated and have no direct bearing on the stay.

  • 152. Straight Grandmother  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:52 am

    And I would like to know who is the idiot that granted her an honorary doctorate? What were they thinking?

  • 153. adambink  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:55 am

    Hey folks, several videos posted above.

  • 154. James Tuttle  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:59 am

    That makes sense. Do you think he will rule on this soon? There is no real time limit from what I understand, only that decisions like this are generally made pretty quickly in legal world.

  • 155. Felyx  |  August 10, 2010 at 8:01 am

    Just got the comments up. Enjoy! Felyx

  • 156. Felyx  |  August 10, 2010 at 8:02 am

    LOL! I tried to get a pic of that but a cop wanted me to stay out of the street… bless his heart! Felyx 😛

  • 157. James Tuttle  |  August 10, 2010 at 8:03 am

    Has anyone seen a similar Facebook post from AFER that says the American Bar Association has called for all states to start allowing civil/domestic partnerships? I looked for an article on Google and couldn't find one.

  • 158. Linda  |  August 10, 2010 at 8:05 am

    Why aren't OS couples rushing to get married? If SSM is going to destroy the institution, you'd think OS couples would want to hurry up and tie the knot before the sky falls, pandemonium insues, and the human race becomes extinct. Good grief, people–get married and start procreating, already!!!

  • 159. Kathleen  |  August 10, 2010 at 8:06 am

    They passed a resolution this last weekend.. There were links to the story on the site somewhere

  • 160. Ann S.  |  August 10, 2010 at 8:07 am


  • 161. Tony Douglass in Ca  |  August 10, 2010 at 8:07 am

    I haven't seen it from AFER, but Freedom To Marry posted it.

  • 162. Kathleen  |  August 10, 2010 at 8:08 am

    I think you're missing the point. If ss couples are allowed to get married, os couples won't want to any more. Haven't you been paying attention? :0

  • 163. Bolt  |  August 10, 2010 at 8:12 am

    The NOMarriage supporters, like the histrionic RN in the video, is jaw dropping crazy! I'm delighted that we're not subjected to these imbecile's opinions at the ballot box in California.

    It must be a disgusting feeling to live with these assholes in North Cackalacka.

  • 164. Anonygrl  |  August 10, 2010 at 8:12 am

    I LOVE the kids. And I love the stories of same sex couples adopting special needs kids. I wonder what the stats are on that, compared to heterosexual couples? Anybody have any idea?

  • 165. Kathleen  |  August 10, 2010 at 8:16 am

    Yay! Good news for all of us new-hungry folks. Remember my concern about how I would know what was going on with court filings when/if this case shifts to the 9th Circuit?

    Just received this notice:

    "To current subscribers of the Perry v. Schwarzenegger e-mail announcement list:

    Your subscription to this e-mail announcement list will continue to be used for the appeal of this case to the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Ninth Circuit. At the Ninth Circuit, the appeal is case number 10-16696."

  • 166. Anonygrl  |  August 10, 2010 at 8:17 am

    That is the problem with NOM's message… it is so confusing.

    If SS couples are allowed to marry, do OS couples CHOOSE to stop marrying? Or are they PROHIBITED from doing so? Or do married ones immediately all decide to divorce? Or are they annulled on the spot? Is it one for one, if one SS couple marries, one OS couple has to give up? Can the OS couple later REMARRY if the SS couple divorces? Does it work in reverse, if an OS couple marries, does a SS couple have to divorce?

    Or do the skies just open up and everybody dies?

    The inquiring mind wants to know!

  • 167. Ann S.  |  August 10, 2010 at 8:17 am

    Thank goodness. I might run out of legal papers to read otherwise.

  • 168. Kathleen  |  August 10, 2010 at 8:20 am

    Actually, I think their recent message is that they'll all have to have "gay marriages." So I guess they'll have to get married to someone of the same sex. It's not clear what, if anything, they're supposed to do about their current spouse.

  • 169. Kathleen  |  August 10, 2010 at 8:21 am

    :) Love you!

  • 170. Straight Grandmother  |  August 10, 2010 at 8:21 am

    In the last video OMG those twins are so cute :) :) :) What a nice, nice, nice happy family. I loved hearing from the children. And the little boy remembered he drew a bear and a dog on his sign in kindergarten, the sign which was about his family. Anyone, anyone please tell me why these two lovely loving dad's cannot get legally married in North Carolina??? It is soooo sooo wrong.

  • 171. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 10, 2010 at 8:23 am

    BZ and I just got home from Raleigh. Yes, I managed to keep him out of trouble and out of jail, but between the two of us, we were interviewed by four TV stations, one local LGBT magazine, two radio stations (including the local NPR affiliate, and Phyllis. In fact, I just got off the phone with Arisha, and I can only say this about her: She is even sweeter in person than she is on these posts. And Phyllis is just a totally terrific lady. Unfortunately, did not get to meet Ant, but we hope to meet up soon. It was just so wonderful to see all the Rainbow Tribe, including our straight allies, who turned out for this event today, and there was just so much love along the entire front of the Justice Building across East Edenton Street from the Capitol Building. We even had two chihuahuas there. Wonder how Louie will spin these two. They spent more time getting their leashes twisted together and looking up at their humans as if to say "get us out of here; something stinks close by." It is just such an experience to get the chance to be part of history in the making. Folks, we have won a major battle with Judge Walker's decision on Prop H8, but if we are to win the war, even more of us need to become active, and get involved. For us, today was not just about our own marriage, but also about making sure that any of our grandchildren who may be gay are able to get married near home, with family and friends surrounding them. Nobody should be forced to make several trips out of state in order to get married. If they WANT to go out of state for their wedding, that is one thing, but to be forced to go out of state to get married, and to then have to carry a ton of legal work to prove that you are married, is not fair. And today, North Carolina made me proud. We had folks here standing for equality from all over the state, even from the area near Asheville. AS usual, the NOMbies had the police there to "protect' them from us. Or maybe the police were actually trying to protect US from the NOMbies. Today was very historic, and we got to meet more of our P8TT family, and nobody went to jail or even got threatened with jail. I will send pictures once I can figure out how to set up a photobucket account and get them up there.

  • 172. Anonygrl  |  August 10, 2010 at 8:24 am

    Yay!!! Since WE all rely on YOU for news… that IS good news!!!


  • 173. Ann S.  |  August 10, 2010 at 8:24 am

    Right back atcha. :)

  • 174. Anonygrl  |  August 10, 2010 at 8:26 am

    Great! So glad you were there to represent us all! Can't WAIT for the pictures!

  • 175. Matthew  |  August 10, 2010 at 8:26 am

    I really hope someone gets to appeal the ruling to the supreme court. We are unlikely to get another decision like this again. A decision so eloquent and crafted to be so bulletproof. We'll win more decisions in other places, but this thing is a gem and we should push it all the way to SCOTUS.

    Seems to me that a win for the plaintiffs in this case, without moving to higher court is a loss for the gay community at large.

    I want a binding decision, not just 'persuasive authority'

  • 176. Sheryl Carver  |  August 10, 2010 at 8:28 am

    Yeah, too, Kathleen!!!!

    It so great to have knowledgeable legal folks like you & Ann S. & others to let us know what's going on &, perhaps more importantly for us unknowledgeable folks, what it all means.

    It takes much too long for anything to appear in MSM. :-(

  • 177. Anna Bryan  |  August 10, 2010 at 8:34 am

    I have some questions for Brian, please P8TT's:

    "He has created his own personal peculiar faith, strong and irrefutable, and inserted it straight into the heart of the U.S. Constitution"
    Is this better or worse than inserting your religious idealogy into our laws?

    "The seven million decent law abiding Californians"
    Last time I checked, rapists murderers and thieves were permitted to vote in CA. Are these the law abiding citizens that he is referring to?

    "One voice not captive to the reigning disdain of the elites for American’s marriage views is Rush Limbaugh."
    I think Rush recently paid one million dollars to have a homosexual sing at his third (maybe fourth) wedding. If Rush isn't an "elite", what exactly does one have to do to be included in this club?

    "In less than three years, we’ve grown from nothing to a $9 million organization"
    How much of that $9 million is left after he purchased his Mansion in the wealthiest neighborhood in America?

  • 178. Felyx  |  August 10, 2010 at 8:37 am

    I have finished all the comments and have loaded all the pics. Enjoy everyone!


  • 179. Straight Grandmother  |  August 10, 2010 at 8:37 am

    Richard, many thanks for your first person account. So glad you mentioned the dogs as I saw them in Felyx's pics and was worried that we would soon see another BS Brown e-mail about attack chihuahuas brought in to intimidate the NOM hetro only marriage supporters.

    When your interviews show up in the press if you can come back and provide us with the links I will appreciate it, I'll want to see these.

    Your enthusiasim and convictions to end Marriage Discrimination are admirable, my hat is off to you. You have my deepest respect.

    I don't remember if it was you or Felyx who wrote that a local Equality Organization was not going to participate but then they changed their mind at the last minute and joined in, that was refreshing to me.

    In the videos I could hear a lot of cars honking their horns which I assume was support and validation for our side. I also heard a lot of yelling and chanting from our side so you know that made this old grandma happy. Let the press see and hear that we are upset with the status quo and NOM's message. Nothing wrong with that :)

  • 180. Straight Grandmother  |  August 10, 2010 at 8:42 am

    Me too Mathew, me too. When would we ever get the dream team of Olson and Boies again? AFER takes donations from everybody, all over the country not just California residents. They are the ones funding the court case. I wish we could hear directly fromt he plaintiffs on this issue.

  • 181. Straight Ally #3008  |  August 10, 2010 at 8:49 am


    You're right about how it lets them demonize you guys, but I think some percentage of them honestly believe being gay is a choice – look at PFOX and ex-gay ministries. Now, I used to favor questions along the lines of "When did you choose to be straight?" However, this is what I think is going on: the true believers think everyone is straight, that's the part that isn't a choice, and the troublesome LGBT types, darn it, just aren't following the program. So they won't even be fazed by the fact that they never chose to be straight. Thankfully, I was never a fundie, so that's strictly an outsider's take on the situation.

  • 182. Dave P.  |  August 10, 2010 at 8:53 am

    Hi Felyx,

    Those pictures are great and I love the comments you added. And your poster is wonderful! Very romantic : ) You and Kevyn are adorable!

    (BTW, we all used to call him Kirille, but I see him called Kevyn lately, and I'm wondering what Kirille/Kevyn prefers for us to call him?).

  • 183. bJason  |  August 10, 2010 at 8:55 am

    "Then, I will tell them Judge Vaughn Walker's name and make them promise to remember."

    The only thing I can think to add to the other comments (through my tears) is that were I Judge Walker – I could not imagine being more deeply touched by anything.

    Pictures ARE worth a thousand words. Words are worth more than gold.

    Thank you for sharing.

    <3 Jason

  • 184. Straight Grandmother  |  August 10, 2010 at 8:57 am

    @Felyx, OMG you are so cute. Is kevyn as cute as you? I can't wait to see a pic of the 2 of you together.

  • 185. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 10, 2010 at 8:58 am

    We are in the Bible Belt, and the Southern Baptist Convention pretty much has a lock on NC. What they don't have a lock on, the President Momson has, or Pope Benedict.
    BTW, Can someone on here PM me through FB and tell me how I am supposed to upload my pictures and some a friend took, using flickr. I have them separated into a file for Raleigh Equality Rally, but I can't get them to upload to the flickr page so I can post the link here. HELP!!!

  • 186. fiona64  |  August 10, 2010 at 9:00 am

    Felyx, thank you so much for all of those photographs. I particularly liked being able to put faces to names for you and Papa Foma.

    Love and big hugs,

  • 187. Dave P.  |  August 10, 2010 at 9:01 am

    "between the two of us, we were interviewed by four TV stations, one local LGBT magazine, two radio stations (including the local NPR affiliate, and Phyllis."

    Yeah, getting the message out there! Well done, Richard!!

  • 188. bJason  |  August 10, 2010 at 9:01 am

    Good god!


  • 189. Straight Grandmother  |  August 10, 2010 at 9:07 am

    Many thanks to all I gotta go to bed now, it's 1am here, tomorrow is another fresh day. Maybe we will get a decision on the stay tomorrow

  • 190. Dave P.  |  August 10, 2010 at 9:14 am

    Hi Felyx,

    OK, I'm confused – on your poster, is that a picture of you and Kevyn/Kirille? How did you do that? Or is it a picture of two other people? And if so, who are those guys?

  • 191. Dave P.  |  August 10, 2010 at 9:19 am

    G'night, SGM!

  • 192. bJason  |  August 10, 2010 at 9:23 am

    Dammit – more tears. Would that I had invested in Kimberly Clark (the makers of Kleenex) before all this started!

  • 193. Breaking the Silence  |  August 10, 2010 at 9:29 am

    Yes, I too believe that we should expect to hear ever-increasing shrillness, loudness and inanity coming from Mr. Brown and company. Due to the aforementioned desperate attempts to activate their base, as well as what I'm coming to understand as the implosion of a mindset/world view that is willfully based somewhere other than in reality and is highly dependent on forcing reality to bend to its will rather than engaging in a rational process that goes the other way around. This mindset perverts something admirable such as as standing up for the best interests of humanity with all available knowledge considered into "lovingly standing up for the traditional values that made our country great…" while going through great pains and effort to maintain its justifications for doing so. Well..when the feet are effectively held to the fire for too long, get ready for the fireworks as the self-deluded mind engages in a life and death struggle to maintain itself and enforce its will upon others. Just as a virus does not discriminate based on the intelligence, education, social standing, etc. of one it infects, these qualities also do not render one immune to the above-described mental pathology. We can pretty much watch it in action on FauX News channel any evening.

  • 194. bJason  |  August 10, 2010 at 9:29 am

    I had to stop here:

    "There is no shortage of evidence, scholarly and otherwise…"

    My question is why didn't they present ANY OF this voluminous body of evidence at trial?

    Answer that, Brian (hi, Brian)!!

    No, really, ANSWER THAT!

  • 195. Lightning Baltimore  |  August 10, 2010 at 9:35 am

    They didn't have to, silly! They said themselves that they didn't need to present evidence.

  • 196. bJason  |  August 10, 2010 at 9:41 am

    My sign would now be

    "Marriage is not a Reich!"

  • 197. Joel  |  August 10, 2010 at 9:46 am

    Well, it's just 4:45 here on the west coast, and no sign of a ruling from Judge Walker vis-a-vis the stay, so I guess it'll be tomorrow?

  • 198. bJason  |  August 10, 2010 at 9:47 am

    True that, LB! Too bad for them that the court kinda needed it, though!

  • 199. Felyx  |  August 10, 2010 at 9:53 am

    Thanks to all of you for your support! To answer some questions…

    What's in a name? – We have decided, the two of us, to choose completely new names for when we get married. Our birth names bring us sad memories at times. We decided we will start a new life and a new family. It is like a rite of passage… perhaps a gay one. ;`) Both names show solidarity and have a deeper meaning for us. We are dedicated to each other. Whether anyone considers us friends, furries or faggots… we suggest you call us what you will! :`)

    Picture Pages – The picture of the gay couple is from the Advocate magazine with the recent article on couples and gay life. Papa Thoms poster had quite a few more of these couples as well as the two boys from here in Raleigh featured in the article. I added our avatar pictures by printing out enlarged images on our printer. I have the gay pride heart and the one under Kevyn is titles Gay Russian Heart… I thought it was so appropriate.

    As far as posting a pic of us together… I anxiously await the day I can do that for us all! Link to our facebook page so that you will be included when we put out wedding invitations to our Second Life virtual wedding.

    We love you all and we thank you for all your love and support!

    Felyx & Kevyn

  • 200. bJason  |  August 10, 2010 at 9:53 am

    It is sad, really.
    I am sure that Brian didn't choose to be gay.
    Maggie, maybe. But too late.
    Louis, DAILY. But Brian won't come out.

    There was a time when I fought my orientation (but only inwardly).

    Run to the light, Carol Ann!! Run to the light!

  • 201. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 10, 2010 at 9:57 am

    Thanks to Kevyn and Felyx, I have finally figured out how to upload the pictures from today's rally to flickr and share them here. Enjoy, everybody!

  • 202. bJason  |  August 10, 2010 at 10:08 am

    Hello Love! (under my breath/subliminal – or at least sublingual(?): "marry me" :) )

    So I have a question or two.

    Given the missed deadline, does the County have a chance of becoming a defendant with standing through the 9th Circuit?

    Should the County be allowed to participate in the appeal, can they present any new evidence (not having been an original Defendant)?

  • 203. Josiah  |  August 10, 2010 at 10:09 am

    I love the sign that says "Marriage is between a honey bunny and a sweetie punkin"!

  • 204. bJason  |  August 10, 2010 at 10:12 am

    Does this mean that an appeal has been granted?

  • 205. Josiah  |  August 10, 2010 at 10:13 am

    Felyx, can you explain the Чебурашка (Cheburashka)? He's cute, but what does he have to do with marriage equality?

  • 206. Dave P.  |  August 10, 2010 at 10:15 am

    Aw crap tomorrow is going to be a loooong day.

    (Hi Joel!)

  • 207. bJason  |  August 10, 2010 at 10:19 am

    I agree. It is tough. Those in CA should have marriages now (given the ruling). The rest of us really could benefit from THIS record. I want it to go all the way without a stay!

  • 208. Kathleen  |  August 10, 2010 at 10:28 am

    I've seen pictures of Kevyn. He's VERY cute.

  • 209. David  |  August 10, 2010 at 10:36 am

    Linda, that is BRILLIANT.

    And yes yes yes to Anonygrl's poster idea!!!

  • 210. David  |  August 10, 2010 at 10:38 am

    Separate story, but there was a huge stink about that article when it came out, and serious criticism of the author and editors. The author shared that the aftermath brought her to tears.

  • 211. David  |  August 10, 2010 at 10:39 am

    There was an excellent lead editorial in the Los Angeles Times yesterday (August 9, 2010) also.

  • 212. Josiah  |  August 10, 2010 at 10:53 am

    Oh, never mind — I saw your comment in Richard's flickr stream. Cheburashka and Chinchiyashka are you and Kirill, right? How sweet!

  • 213. David  |  August 10, 2010 at 11:01 am

    I'm no more "discouraged" by their having such a plan — not a surprise in the least — than by any of their preceding statements and behavior. In fact I'd love nothing better than for them to pursue further folly — to keep on with their initiatives, campaigns, and events. (It's going to be a let-down while the bus tour finally ends in a few days — seriously. It's been very entertaining on many levels. It'll be like the last day at an enormously fun summer camp.)

    Campaign for a Constitutional Amendment? Bring it on!!!!! Do something George W. Bush supported but could get no movement on! I'd be happy to see NOM waste even more of their donors' money. The donors would get what they deserve.

    You know what else promises to be hilarious? Mitt Romney distancing himself from being anti-SSM, something he used very cynically for attempted political gain (after previously being a gay rights supporter, also for attempted political gain). He is a serious slime. The good news is that he cannot possibly distance himself from his having led the charge to oppose marriage equality in Massachusetts, and then bragging about same when he ran for President in 2008.

  • 214. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 10, 2010 at 11:18 am

    From here in Raleigh:

  • 215. Straight Grandmother  |  August 10, 2010 at 11:29 am

    North Carolina RERESENTS!!!
    To each adn every person who came out today for Gender Neutral Marriage, Horray for YOU!!!!
    I’m loving the pictures and the numbers, you slammed NOM!!! End Discrimination NOW!!! GO North Carolina!!!!!

  • 216. Alan E.  |  August 10, 2010 at 11:30 am

    In other news, lawyers look to record profits as potential divorce claims look to increase.

  • 217. fiona64  |  August 10, 2010 at 11:31 am

    Um, Apricot? There were 16 people on NOM’s side in Atlanta. Reports from Raleigh vary from 25-50 NOM people, with reports ranging from 150-250 pro-equality protestors.


  • 218. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 10, 2010 at 11:37 am

    And Josiah, I have Felyx, Kevyn, and Skype to thank for that photostream getting posted. Baruch HaShem for the younger generation and their extensive computer knowledge!

  • 219. Josiah  |  August 10, 2010 at 11:38 am

    Oops — I should say Kevyn, not the old name. Моя ошибка (tr.: my bad).

  • 220. Josiah  |  August 10, 2010 at 11:39 am

    Richard, Baruch HaShem indeed! Or, as Kevyn might put it, Слава Богу!

  • 221. Mark M  |  August 10, 2010 at 12:13 pm


  • 222. Box Turtle Bulletin &raqu&hellip  |  August 10, 2010 at 12:31 pm

    […] City Plazas in to Raleigh, North Carolina, today and absolutely nothing noteworthy happened. They had about 61 supporters in their mostly-empty plaza and there were significantly more […]

  • 223. Sheryl  |  August 10, 2010 at 1:46 pm

    Felix, loved the comments to your pictures. Thanks for sharing.

  • 224. Felyx  |  August 10, 2010 at 3:26 pm


    You are delightful. Yes, Cheburashka and Chinchilla are our pet names. Please join our facebook page (leave a comment so we know who you are. Thanks.)

    Love F&K

  • 225. Dpeck  |  August 10, 2010 at 3:29 pm

    No, it just measn that Kathleen, Ann and others here who have been getting updates via an email announcement list will continue to get new anouncements about trial-related issues (the stay, the appeal, etc.) from that same email list. They are not shutting down the announcement list even though the actual trial has now ended.

  • 226. Felyx  |  August 10, 2010 at 3:31 pm

    That Nurse… Oh God! She is seriously Old School. I am scared to work with nurses like her. I had one as a caregiver in the post-op during a recent surgery… it really was inappropriate as I was there to heal and not hear about personal beliefs.

    I am an RN and I gotta say, in my experience she is not exactly the rare case. Thank heaven she is one of a rapidly dying breed. Bless her shrunken heart!

    Felyx, RN

  • 227. Felyx  |  August 10, 2010 at 3:38 pm


    Thank you for noticing the comments. This whole event has been awkwardly stressful. To have to stand there protesting substandard treatment from the self-righteously pompous is heavily demoralizing. I thought I would try to be innocuous and listen to the speech but as much as we poke fun at it, it really is shameful sugar-coated hatred. It is sickening and just drains your energy. The humorous comments are my way of relieving my tension. If others get a laugh out of it then all the more blessings.

    Thank you all and keep up the good work.


  • 228. Felyx  |  August 10, 2010 at 3:41 pm

    Blessings Richard. Thank you for catching all the wonderful signs… and my feet. 😛 Felyx

  • 229. Kathleen  |  August 10, 2010 at 3:41 pm

    I enjoyed all the picts and comments, too. And just have to say, you are one handsome man.

    Thanks for putting up with those horrible people to represent all of us. BIG HUGS – wish I was there to give them for real. xoxo

  • 230. Kathleen  |  August 10, 2010 at 3:42 pm

    Yeah, what Dave said. It's just saying that when/IF the case is taken up by the 9th Circuit, the same email notification system that's been in place will continue notifying us of all filings in the case. So, you'll all continue to get the same service you've come to know and love. :)

  • 231. Franck  |  August 10, 2010 at 5:52 pm

    Felyx, I agree with the others, you look real good. Thanks for the photos! Nice to see that even in the so-called Bible Belt, more people show up to support equality than bigotry.

    I like the comments you put there too, they brought a few much-needed chuckles here. Also, thanks for representing us there!

    – Franck P. Rabeson
    Days spent apart from my fiancé because of DOMA: 1146 days, as of today.

  • 232. Michael  |  August 10, 2010 at 7:08 pm

    Militant anti-gay activist Brown insults our Lord by equating Love with radical anti-gay activist King's homophobia.

  • 233. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 11, 2010 at 4:53 am

    I just wish all of you coould have been at Greek Fiesta with us. Thank you, Felyx. Thanks to you, BZ and I have found another very delightful place to eat when we are in Raleigh, and it is one that will always have beautiful memories because of the after-rally lunch with family.

  • 234. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 11, 2010 at 4:55 am

    Sorry about those two. I think those may have been a result of when I kept the camera on without turning it off between pictures. Thank you again for all your help getting them uploaded, and thanks for the gathering at Greek Fiesta afterward.

  • 235. Regan DuCasse  |  August 11, 2010 at 9:55 am

    O…M…G, what CUTE twins. Their faces are like two beautiful moons.
    Hey, dads been together over 20 years…raised preemie babies who tend to be fragile at birth, who are the very picture of healthy, winsome children.
    They are LUCKIER than a lot of America' s children. It's not rocket science why.
    Loving and being loved, thought THAT was the undisputed formula for a good and happy life.

  • 236. Regan DuCasse  |  August 11, 2010 at 9:56 am

    Arisha…you ROCK!!!

  • 237. Richard A. Walter (s  |  August 11, 2010 at 10:08 am

    We were just a few feet away from this family, and I got to talk to them. This interview is great, but unfortunately on camera you can't get the full effect of how these guys feel about their children and how much they love them. In fact, during the equality rally , they were close to the wall, then in front of them without blocking their view was the couple who had the "killer chihuahuas" then us. And I think it was very appropriate that the building all of us who were there for equality was in front of was the Justice Building.

  • 238. NOM’s version of th&hellip  |  October 2, 2010 at 8:02 am

    […] of course, we remember Joann Beckman from the North Carolina stop on the summer tour, spouting debunked Ruth Institute “research” regarding how children […]

  • 239. NOM’s version of the ca&hellip  |  October 2, 2010 at 8:49 am

    […] of course, we remember Joann Beckman from the North Carolina stop on the summer tour, spouting debunked Ruth Institute “research” regarding how children of […]

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