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BREAKING: Iowa Supreme Court Justices ousted in retention vote driven by marriage equality decision

NOM Exposed NOM Tour Tracker-Iowa Right-wing

By Eden James

It’s over in Iowa.

96% precincts reporting:

Supreme Court – Retain Baker
No: 54.1%
Yes: 45.9%

Supreme Court – Retain Streit
No: 54.1%
Yes: 45.9%

Supreme Court – Retain Ternus
No: 54.7%
Yes: 45.3%

The Iowa Supreme Court justices issued the following statement moments ago:

It was our great privilege to serve the people of Iowa for many years. Throughout our judicial service we endeavored to serve the people of Iowa by always adhering to the rule of law, making decisions fairly and impartially according to the law, and faithfully upholding the constitution.

We wish to thank all of the Iowans who voted to retain us for another term. Your support shows that many Iowans value fair and impartial courts. We also want to acknowledge and thank all the Iowans, from across the political spectrum and from different walks of life, who worked tirelessly over the past few months to defend Iowa’s high-caliber court system against an unprecedented attack by out-of-state special interest groups.

Finally, we hope Iowans will continue to support Iowa’s merit selection system for appointing judges. This system helps ensure that judges base their decisions on the law and the Constitution and nothing else. Ultimately, however, the preservation of our state’s fair and impartial courts will require more than the integrity and fortitude of individual judges, it will require the steadfast support of the people.

Chief Justice Marsha Ternus
Associate Justice Michael Streit
Associate Justice David Baker

The Courage Campaign and the Human Rights Campaign just sent the following press release:

Iowa Courts Hijacked By National Organization for Marriage Intimidation Campaign

Marriage equality remains law in Iowa

WASHINGTON — After tonight’s defeat of the three Iowa state Supreme Court justices who ruled in favor of marriage equality last year, the Human Rights Campaign and Courage Campaign condemned the National Organization for Marriage’s efforts to intimidate judges across the country.

NOM’s president Brian Brown has admitted (here) that his group’s effort in Iowa’s judicial election was actually about intimidating judges around the country into ruling against equality for millions of loving American families. In Iowa, NOM spent an unprecedented $600,000 on TV ads and a 45-county bus tour.  Despite NOM’s mean-spirited and fear-driven campaign, same-sex marriage remains legal in Iowa. 

“By their own admission, NOM’s Iowa strategy was about sending a warning shot to judges nationwide,” said HRC President Joe Solmonese. “NOM and its secret donors will target judges around the country if they rule in favor of marriage equality and will foster an anti-gay, hostile environment in the process.”

“Having seen its extremist agenda increasingly rejected by the courts and the American people, it is telling that NOM has now settled on a strategy of evading tax and election laws and trying to intimidate judges,” said Courage Campaign Founder and Chairman Rick Jacobs. “These are the tactics one might expect from Al Capone, not a credible political organization.”  

Prior to its involvement in this election, NOM received a strong warning from Iowa’s ethics agency for evading campaign laws. During a 2009 special election in the state, NOM told supporters they could contribute to its Iowa campaign efforts secretly–without disclosing their names.  Iowa law requires disclosure of contributors to political campaigns.   

NOM is also fighting campaign finance laws in New York, Washington, Rhode Island, California and Maine, where it remains under investigation by the Maine Ethics Commission for failing to register with the state as a ballot question committee and refusing to disclose the donors to its campaign to overturn Maine’s marriage equality law in 2009.

The Washington Independent has reported that NOM is funneling charitable donations into political campaigns. NOM’s charitable arm, The Ruth Institute, was also the subject of a recent IRS complaint filed by HRC and the Courage Campaign for repeated violations of federal law prohibiting charitable organizations from advocating on behalf of political campaigns.

UPDATE: Statement from One Iowa’s Carolyn Jenison on Iowa’s election results:

On April 3, 2009, Iowans celebrated a historic Iowa Supreme Court decision that granted the freedom to marry to gay and lesbian couples. This ruling continued a long tradition of recognizing equal rights for all Iowans. It was a hard fought victory and we knew we would have to work very hard to protect it in the years ahead. Over the past year and a half Iowans have fought off and beaten back every attempt to diminish this ruling.

In this election, three of the courageous justices who recognized the freedom to marry in Iowa fell victim to a perfect storm of electoral discontent and out-of-state special interest money. In addition, many of our pro-equality allies from Governor Culver to statehouse candidates lost their seats due to an anti-incumbent mood that swept the nation. We thank them for their distinguished service and we look forward to working with our newly elected legislature and Governor in the weeks and months ahead.

While the full implications of these election results remain to be seen, one thing remains the same:

The freedom to marry in Iowa remains intact.

In the months and weeks ahead we can expect renewed attempts to overturn the freedom to marry and write discrimination into the Iowa Constitution. It will take a concerted and collective effort on the part of pro-equality Iowans to respond to these attacks and defend on our liberties. We hope you’ll join us.

This is no time to be discouraged. While our fight may be tireless, our mission is clear. Together, we will protect marriage equality and preserve Iowa’s long tradition of equal rights for all.

With Gratitude,

Carolyn Jenison,
Executive Director

228 Comments

  • 1. Kathleen  |  November 2, 2010 at 4:40 pm

    A glimmer of good news from Hawaii.
    Democrat Neil Abercrombie, solidly in favor of marriage equality, elected governor.

  • 2. Kathleen  |  November 2, 2010 at 4:41 pm

    This news from Iowa is the most disturbing for me in all the elections.

  • 3. Alan E.  |  November 2, 2010 at 4:41 pm

    Sad day there.

    Apparently there is a veto-proof majority in New Hampshire that Brian is gloating about. Funny thing about that. If marriage equality is taken away from their citizens, it would make another great Prop 8-like case.

  • 4. Alan E.  |  November 2, 2010 at 4:42 pm

    And Rhode Island!

  • 5. Michelle Evans  |  November 2, 2010 at 4:45 pm

    Lucky that we didn't elect NutMeg (Whitman) here in California this evening, but very sad about the Iowa judges, and other pro-equality people being ousted across the country. There are some bright lights, but so many of them will be shut down by the likes Brian and his organization. Now they have won–again. All they do is gain more and more power. Times here in America are getting very scary indeed. Wonder when they'll start passing out the pink triangle armbands.

  • 6. JonT  |  November 2, 2010 at 4:52 pm

    'Prior to its involvement in this election, NOM received a strong warning from Iowa’s ethics agency for evading campaign laws.'

    Which it seemed to be able to ignore….

    'NOM is also fighting campaign finance laws in New York, Washington, Rhode Island, California and Maine, where it remains under investigation by the Maine Ethics Commission for failing to register with the state as a ballot question committee and refusing to disclose the donors to its campaign to overturn Maine’s marriage equality law in 2009…'

    Which they seem to also be able to ignore.

    What's the point of laws when you can just ignore them?

  • 7. JonT  |  November 2, 2010 at 4:53 pm

    'Now they have won–again. All they do is gain more and more power.'

    No they didn't. They won some, we won some. Lets not get all depressed. I can't say there were any real surprises so far in this election…

  • 8. Michelle Evans  |  November 2, 2010 at 4:54 pm

    NOM has always made a point when it sends out letters and emails asking for donations, saying that it will never give away info on who is giving them money. They are fully confident that they will never be forced to disclose–and it appears that in the end everyone WILL bend to their desire–and things will just get more and more dark as time goes on.

  • 9. Kathleen  |  November 2, 2010 at 4:56 pm

    JonT, I'm really struggling to not get all depressed…. :(

  • 10. JonT  |  November 2, 2010 at 4:58 pm

    Well Alan, lets also keep in mind that just because the red's have the NH senate and house, doesn't mean they are also religious fundamentalists like NOM.

    One thing I have noticed over the last few years is the red's increasing reluctance to buy into the religious right's 'culture wars'.

  • 11. Michelle Evans  |  November 2, 2010 at 5:00 pm

    This night reminds me sort of what happened in 2008. Many of us were excited that Obama won, but then very depressed when Prop 8 did, too. Here in California tonight, we got Brown over Whitman, which is great, but we also got Steve Cooley in as Attorney General, and he has always said he will do anything he can to defend Prop 8. And the race for Senate is still too close to call between Boxer and anti-equality Carly.

    Yes, a lot to be depressed about. The Iowa judge vote shows the way of the future. They succeeded in doing exactly what they wanted to do–send a message–and I'm sure a lot of state court judges will get the NOM message loud and clear. We've been sliding downhill for the past year in politics–and to see wins from people like Rand Paul and other tea baggers, is showing the trend on where we are headed.

  • 12. JonT  |  November 2, 2010 at 5:01 pm

    Then I will email you some pictures of puppies and kitties :)

  • 13. Phil L  |  November 2, 2010 at 5:02 pm

    I do have a pretty strong feeling that some day soon their smugness will come back and bite them in the arse.

    If they are investigated by the IRS and found guilty of violating election laws and the like they will probably run into some real trouble.

  • 14. Kathleen  |  November 2, 2010 at 5:07 pm

    Please do. It's probably time for some otter videos.

  • 15. Straight Ally #3008  |  November 2, 2010 at 5:08 pm

    It's a squeaker, but hopefully Minnesota, too!

  • 16. Straight Ally #3008  |  November 2, 2010 at 5:08 pm

    It's NOM at its most petty and evil.

  • 17. Elizabeth Oakes  |  November 2, 2010 at 5:09 pm

    *shakes head sadly*
    There's no point in having campaign and ethics laws if there are no teeth behind them–I guess people don't see how important transparency is. Without such enforcement (and with the Supreme Court recently unleashing unlimited corporate money into campaigns) we're heading into a very dark time for people who believe in democracy.

    It'll take everything we have to fight it, and it will be a long haul I think–perhaps until several new Supreme Court justices are seated and able to undo some of this heinousness. I'm in, I'll keep rallying, but I'm not expecting solid changes to our electoral process anytime soon.

    Meanwhile, I'll try to be thankful California didn't fall prey to Meg Whitman and her minions, and hope that marriage equality will be restored here somehow within the next administration, either by the courts or another ballot initiative….

  • 18. Straight Ally #3008  |  November 2, 2010 at 5:11 pm

    Is anyone organizing some formal statement of support that we can convey to these brave judges?

    Meanwhile, NOM, you just keep pumping the bilge water out of your slowly sinking ship….

  • 19. Elizabeth Oakes  |  November 2, 2010 at 5:11 pm

    But it will be too little too late, damage already done, plus providing encouragement to other radical religious groups who want to terrorize jurists and politicians into imposing dogma into law.

  • 20. Kathleen  |  November 2, 2010 at 5:14 pm

    Kamala Harris closing the spread. Cooley only leads by 1.9% with just under 1/2 the precincts reporting.

  • 21. Straight Ally #3008  |  November 2, 2010 at 5:16 pm

    Just because it still rings true, in a different context, today:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bKDVNSpsBZE

  • 22. BK  |  November 2, 2010 at 6:19 pm

    I want to throw up. This is disgusting.

  • 23. Franck  |  November 2, 2010 at 6:47 pm

    I’m really struggling to not get all depressed

    You and me both, Kathleen. Seen from my side, any chance of a positive federal evolution on LGBTQ issues has essentially vanished for the next two years at least.

    I think it's time for me to start getting used to regularly seeing the bus's underside, heh.

    – Franck P. Rabeson
    Days spent apart from my fiancé because of DOMA: 1230 days, as of today.

  • 24. matthew  |  November 2, 2010 at 6:57 pm

    This is definitely sad to see NOM succeed in bending so many mostly ignorant people to their will. Especially since their entire bus tour was full of lies and hate.

    But then again, I have faith that in the end it will have the opposite of the stated goals. Judges bust their asses to become judges, and they don't get there if they are easily intimidated.

    The decision NOM is mad about in Iowa was a UNANIMOUS decision. Most judges know discrimination when they see it.

  • 25. Franck  |  November 2, 2010 at 6:57 pm

    P.S. : Preaching to the choir much here, but I recently posted this to a pair of LGBT groups on deviantART. Now more than ever, I feel the weight of what I pictured in that piece.

    – Franck P. Rabeson
    Days spent apart from my fiancé because of DOMA: 1230 days, as of today.

  • 26. Petr Tomeš  |  November 2, 2010 at 7:26 pm

    Harris leads! http://vote.sos.ca.gov/returns/attorney-general/

  • 27. Dave  |  November 2, 2010 at 8:05 pm

    Sad day indeed. With the results in Iowa and the Republicans taking bake the house. I am so depressed. O well, 2 more years another election, hope we can improve things by then.

    Harris is leading now in the result. I hope she wins, but it is so close it might not be for weeks that we find out who actually won.

    If the disaster happens and Cooley wins, what does that mean for appeal of proposition 8, if he decides to defend it?

  • 28. Philip  |  November 2, 2010 at 9:09 pm

    I have compassion for those who suffer from any kind of disorder, there is no reason to ever hate anyone for choices they make. I believe our country is being destroyed by this gay movement, our social fabric is being torn apart. I am not talking religion of any kind. But just on a phycological and physical level our minds like our bodies have thru the process of evolution evolved with a set of needs. An architecture if you will, that to remain healthy you must feed. I abhor your claims and I and my wife teach our children not to hate, but to be cautious, because if I use the word fear we become homophobic. I genuinally mean no offense, and if you were hungry i would love and feed anyone of you.

  • 29. Michael  |  November 2, 2010 at 9:34 pm

    What NOM is doing is disgusting and unamerican. It's beginning to feel like East Germany here where the government controlled the judiciary. Now, if any judge does not back the (anti-gay) Party Line, he/she will be dismissed. Is this really what our founding fathers had in mind when they created 3 branches of government? And why is our Federal Government refusing to investigate the radical anti-gay pressure group NOM? Why are they allowed again and again to ignore laws which the rest of us have to follow? As they redefine intimidation to become a "value," their arrogance is astounding! I can only imagine their campaign law violations will be totally ignored by our new pro-homophobia House whose stated number 1 priority will be to make Obama a "one term President."

  • 30. Franck  |  November 2, 2010 at 9:42 pm

    Philip, abhorence is a type of fear, and the damaging kind. Fear leads you to avoid something. Abbhorence leads you to try and destroy it. Politely telling us that we're abnormal and dangerous for society is not so different from flatly stating it to our faces.

    I, for once, think that the greatest dangers to the fabric of society are selfishness and fear of the other. You're welcome to redirect the blame on people who just ask for the right to love, of course, but don't think it will make you appear morally or intellectually superior.

    – Franck P. Rabeson
    Days spent apart from my fiancé because of DOMA: 1230 days, as of today.

  • 31. Phil L  |  November 2, 2010 at 9:49 pm

    What claims do you "abhor" (which essentially means hate, by the way) exactly? Do you abhor the idea that we are who we are and simply wish to not be descriminated against? I have been in a monogamous relationship for ten years but can be denied any connections to him on a legal level unless I spend thousands of dollars in legal fees to have power of attorney paperwork drawn up, and even THAT can be contested. Married couples don't have these problems or legal hassles.

    How is our quest for these rights ripping the fabric of society apart exactly? You love who you love and we love who we love, and that is irrefutable and unchanging.

  • 32. Sagesse  |  November 2, 2010 at 9:52 pm

    It is truly disgusting. However, I seem to recall reading that Branstad did not intend to try to overturn marriage equality? Regardless, it takes years in Iowa to put a DOMA on the ballot. Minnesota and RI are good news.

  • 33. Straight Ally #3008  |  November 2, 2010 at 10:05 pm

    …our bodies have thru the process of evolution evolved with a set of needs.

    Bzzzzzt. Homosexual behavior occurs in nature. And sexual orientation is not a choice. Thanks for playing, though.

  • 34. Ķĭŗîļĺę&  |  November 2, 2010 at 10:08 pm

    This is PapaFoma – using Kirillexxi's post office box to send from Russia.
    The trip is wonderful – but the depressing news sort of knocked me down a notch.
    Seeing all the P8TT names and comments has brightened a rainy day — like I am among my friends again!
    We're off to shop in a Russian Super Store to spruce up K's apartment.
    I hope to send more — maybe from St Petersburg??
    Best to all – let's not give up hope!
    Papa

  • 35. Straight Ally #3008  |  November 2, 2010 at 10:09 pm

    I'mma GODWIN this thread up in here. (Sorry, just really sick of NOM this morning and very, very punchy)
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aNi5256dhvM

  • 36. Jess  |  November 2, 2010 at 10:09 pm

    This is ridiculous! That is NOT what the retention vote is for! You should not be able to kick out a judge for ruling on something you disagree with, why is it so easy to get a retention vote on the ballot!?! Now it's a message to judges that says "oh hey, if you don't do what the majority wants, you lose your job." Thank you NOM for breaking our system some more. You freaking suck.

  • 37. Phil L  |  November 2, 2010 at 10:10 pm

    Exactly. That's why asking someone the question, "When did you make the choice to be sexually attracted to the opposite sex?" typically seems to stump the "it's all a choice" crowd.

  • 38. Phil L  |  November 2, 2010 at 10:15 pm

    Retention votes pop up on their own and people tend to just vote "yes" because it's never a contested issue. NOM MADE it an issue and convinced people to vote "no" because they ruled in favor of us "evul gheys!"

  • 39. Matt  |  November 2, 2010 at 10:19 pm

    Nom delenda est!

  • 40. Phil L  |  November 2, 2010 at 10:43 pm

    Kamala Harris seems to have gained more ground on Cooley over the last hour with 94% of precincts reporting.

    It's still a VERY close race, though some media outlets have posted articles about her losing.
    http://vote.sos.ca.gov/returns/attorney-general/

  • 41. Gregory in Salt Lake  |  November 2, 2010 at 11:12 pm

    ((HUGS)) http://www.montereybayaquarium.org/otteru/

  • 42. Gregory in Salt Lake  |  November 2, 2010 at 11:26 pm

    I read your post Franck….Ditto in our household….*big sigh*

    after prop 8 passed a had a big cloud over my head…for about 4 hours then I KNEW it was the very best thing to happen….and Utah and other LGBTQ "woke up"….P8TT and courage campaign got started.

    On the home front Utah is gloating as the super-majority republicans got even more dominant w/this election. I went to bed in a "daze", feeling physically ill.

    This morning I noticed the giant waking up inside of me as did after prop 8 passing. I have the image of the Tea Party getting REALLY obnoxious, making blunders, even more blatant discrimination (aka Loving vs Virginia) then SCOTUS having no choice but award federal equality. I predict it will happen before "the end of the world" in 2012. ((HUGS)) Gregory

  • 43. Rhonda  |  November 2, 2010 at 11:31 pm

    LA Times:

    With more than half the votes counted, Democrat Richard Pan holds a 51% to 45% lead over Republican Andy Pugno in a seat currently held by Republicans.

  • 44. John B.  |  November 2, 2010 at 11:49 pm

    Bad, bad news and to add insult to injury we will never hear the end of the gloating over it from NOM and their anti-gay cronies. Let's hope the ousted justices become strong voices within the state for both same-sex marriage and for the independence of the judiciary. Ironically, one of those three judges was appointed by the very same Republican governor who was just elected (but all three are likely to be replaced by the current Democratic governor before he leaves office).

    But another glimmer of hope from Washington, DC where same-sex marriage became a reality earlier this year: not a single NOM-supported candidate was elected, either in the primaries or in the general election (in fact one of their most promising candidates in the D.C. Council Democratic primary, Delano Hunter, was thoroughly trounced despite an endorsement from the Washington Post and an unpopular incumbent). The DC Council, Attorney General, and incoming mayor Vincent Gray all remain strong supporters of same-sex marriage. Now that it's clear that DC residents aren't nearly as outraged about same-sex marriage as NOM, Harry Jackson, and their friends tried to make us believe, will they finally shut up about the subject and go away? Probably not but even if anybody in Congress starts making noises about repealing our (home-grown, home-supported and court-supported!) legislation, it has no chance of going anywhere.

    Meanwhile, in those states and countries where same-sex marriages are already recognized the sky hasn't fallen and the end of the world hasn't come. Polls show that a rapidly growing number of Americans support same-sex marriage, including majorities in New York probably at least two or three other states. We aren't backing down and we aren't going away, and those of us who are already legally married in DC, Massachusetts, Iowa, etc. will continue to pursue our full marriage rights at the federal level and to have our legal marriages recognized by other states because DOMA will ultimately fail as completely unconstitutional (as the anti-gay right has always known it will, which is precisely why they pushed for an amendment to the U.S. Constitution).

  • 45. Rhonda  |  November 2, 2010 at 11:53 pm

    Philip | November 3, 2010 at 4:09 am
    I have compassion for those who suffer from any kind of disorder, there is no reason to ever hate anyone for choices they make.

    1) Homosexuality is not a disorder (homosexuality was removed from the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual (DSM) in 1973)
    2) Homosexuality is not a choice (Homosexual and bisexual behavior are widespread in the animal kingdom: a 1999 review by researcher Bruce Bagemihl shows that homosexual behavior has been observed in close to 1500 species, ranging from primates to gut worms, and is well documented for 500 of them.)

  • 46. Wade@MacMorrighan.Ne  |  November 2, 2010 at 11:54 pm

    Hey guys, below is the address of the IA. Supreme Court building. Would anyone like to join me in sending three cards thanking the 3 ousted judges for their service and for ensuring that we Gay Iowans are EQUAL citizens? I am, this weekend…

    Iowa Supreme Court
    1111 East Court Avenue
    Des Moines, IA 50319

    Address them, individually, to:

    ATTN: David Baker
    ATTN: Marsha Ternus
    ATTN: Michael Streit

  • 47. fiona64  |  November 2, 2010 at 11:54 pm

    Dear Philip:

    There is an evolutionary basis for homosexuality: it's called reciprocal altruism.

    There have been GLBT people since the beginnings of recorded history, and most likely sooner.

    I'm a straight, married woman — and I think that the *real* thing tearing our country apart is people who try to pretty up their bigotry with words like "caution."

    BTW, you say things like "I mean no offense," you know you're saying something offensive and are preparing to blame those you've offended for your own actions.

    If you were hungry, I would feed you, too — despite your behavior and statements toward my GLBT friends.

  • 48. icapricorn  |  November 2, 2010 at 11:59 pm

    I think you're missing the bigger picture. The whole point of the anti-judge campaign was to chill marriage equality rulings in other jurisdictions. NOM spent all that money to send a message to future judges that they will risk their careers now if they vote in favor of same-sex marriage. That is how NOM rolls. They can only win by fanning fear, and here is the judge-level version of the tactic.

    We can waste time bemoaning the tactic or we can play the game, using the same street-fighting strategy of fear, intimidations and political repercussions against our foes. Remember the civil rights protesters of the 60's had to fight and bleed for every concession they got. Martin Luther King used the passive resistance strategy of Gandhi to shame the country, and we've been doing the same. But these are harsher times. And NOM is using harsher measures, threatening jobs (successfully in Iowa) and conjuring up gay-rights hobgoblins.

    Isn't it time to fight fire with fire? To get down in the mud and use the same tactics of fear, intimidation and political repercussions against our foes? To raise huge war chest to fight these people? On this site, the attitude toward NOM is entirely too lighthearted for my taste. Oh those crazy, stupid people. Well those crazy stupid people are well funded and working 9 to 5 to take as much of your life away as they can. Let's get serious here. Don't merely show up with counter protests and rainbow signs, fuck up their buses!

    I was in ACT-UP New York during the 90's. We laid down on Wall Street and stopped traffic. We chained ourselves to the doors at the National Institutes of Health. Some of it worked, some of it didn't. But it was dangerous and it did make AIDS a "sexier" new story, changing the AIDS "victim" to an AIDS "activist." Isn't it time for little fighting in the streets?

  • 49. jbf  |  November 3, 2010 at 12:12 am

    We need Brian Browns gay lover to come out of the closet now! And as for Maggie, it's time to out her too.

  • 50. Jeffrey Weekley  |  November 3, 2010 at 12:18 am

    Ironically, this will do nothing to change the fact that Iowa has Marriage Equality for two simple reasons:

    1. It was a unanimous decision – judges on both ends of the political spectrum and in the middle agreed that all Iowans have the right to marry the person of their choice.

    2. Any future appointees will likely share that opinion.

    So, really the only thing that seems to be accomplished here is sending judges a message that judging fairly for marriage equality will cost them their jobs. BUT…I don't know any judge in the land who would choose to subvert the Constitution, corrupt the law and deny someone a basic civil right – just to keep a job.

    That NOM would assume our judiciary to be so corruptible is beyong contempt. They are really scum of the earth.

  • 51. Ronnie  |  November 3, 2010 at 12:34 am

    ditto…. :-& …..Ronnie

  • 52. Lesbians Love Boies  |  November 3, 2010 at 12:36 am

    you need some new otter videos!

  • 53. Ronnie  |  November 3, 2010 at 12:40 am

    No Philip….our country is being destroyed by this un-Ameircan, inhuman anti-gay homophobic movement. Our social fabric is being torn apart by Fascist pigs like you….."fear" is not what made you look like a homophobic pig…it was that fact that you just said all the people here who are openly Gay have a "disorder" that makes you look like a homophobic pig…I feel sorry for your children…you don't deserve them…. > ( ….Ronnie

  • 54. TPAKyle  |  November 3, 2010 at 12:41 am

    Love the bigot, hate the bigotry!

  • 55. Gregory in Salt Lake  |  November 3, 2010 at 12:43 am

    !!!!!!!!!!!

  • 56. Rhonda  |  November 3, 2010 at 12:53 am

    ewwwwww! not maggie! yuck! ;)

  • 57. Dave  |  November 3, 2010 at 12:56 am

    This is why I think state judges like federal one, especially those at the higher levels should have lifetime appointments.

    Does any state give their judges lifetime appointments?

  • 58. Bobw  |  November 3, 2010 at 12:59 am

    What the fuck does a Nazi judge have to do with this?

  • 59. Rhonda  |  November 3, 2010 at 1:01 am

    addendum:
    The longstanding consensus of the behavioral and social sciences and the health and mental health professions is that homosexuality per se is a normal and positive variation of human sexual orientation (Bell, Weinberg & Hammersmith, 1981; Bullough, 1976; Ford & Beach 1951 ; Kinsey, Pomeroy, & Martin, 1948; Kinsey, Pomeroy, Martin, & Gebhard, 1953 ).

  • 60. Ronnie  |  November 3, 2010 at 1:02 am

    Pink released what is being called her empowering "It Gets Better" video for "Raise Your Glass" which features her performing at a Gay wedding…..<3…Ronnie:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fIqAfF-2Jdw&fe

  • 61. Gregory in Salt Lake  |  November 3, 2010 at 1:04 am

    Hi LLB : )
    Fiona introduced me to the otteru link…. I like it because have webcam can peek in at meal times…

  • 62. Alan E.  |  November 3, 2010 at 1:05 am

    If the governor and AG disagree on how the state should stand in a case, the governor has final say. Cooley would be able to submit a brief at some point down the road, but officially the state of California will think that Prop 8 is unconstitutional.

  • 63. Gregory in Salt Lake  |  November 3, 2010 at 1:06 am

    There goes Florida : (

    ——————–
    News Alert: Democrat Alex Sink concedes in Florida governor race
    10:47 AM EDT Wednesday, November 3, 2010
    ——————–

    Democrat Alex Sink, Florida's state’s chief financial officer has conceded in the race for Florida governor to Rick Scott, a former health care industry executive who poured millions of dollars into the race.

  • 64. Ronnie  |  November 3, 2010 at 1:07 am

    Here is the victory speech from David Cicilline, openly Gay mayor of Providence, RI who won the race for a congressional seat…..<3…Ronnie:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-sswby2oF6I&fe

  • 65. Alan E.  |  November 3, 2010 at 1:12 am

    Also, there could not be a case to bring to the court because there would be a lack of standing, and changing the constitution in iowa is very difficult and takes a lot of time.

  • 66. fiona64  |  November 3, 2010 at 1:28 am

    "Isn’t it time to fight fire with fire? To get down in the mud and use the same tactics of fear, intimidation and political repercussions against our foes?"

    I prefer to take the higher ground, thanks.

  • 67. John B.  |  November 3, 2010 at 1:30 am

    We are all in this for the long haul and we are certainly going to lose some battles along the way. The Iowa vote is definitely a major loss but the polling and demographics are all trending in our favor and amid all the doom and gloom we need to bear in mind the fact that many pro-same sex candidates were elected and many anti-gay and anti-same sex marriage candidates who were supported by NOM were defeated in this election. Here's a run-down of just a few of them:
    http://www.freedomtomarry.org/press/press-release

  • 68. elliom  |  November 3, 2010 at 1:35 am

    <cite>If you were hungry, I would feed you, too — despite your behavior and statements toward my GLBT friends.</cite>

    In fact, we're trying to feed you (in the universal sense) BECAUSE OF your behavior and statements. That's the whole point of the Feed Equality movement. To TALK about equality, to DO something about it, in a positive, community building way. Your side runs bus tours to kick out impartial justices, we collect food for the hungry. Which seems more moral and compassionate to you?

    On a side note, we at Feed Equality miss hearing from you. We've been doing a lot of work behind the scenes, and have made lots of improvements to our materials, website, and FB page. Please stop by and drop us a note, suggestion, or comment, so we can keep the momentum on this movement, and combat these rediculous prejudices with REAL community action.

  • 69. John B.  |  November 3, 2010 at 1:40 am

    How about "outing" Maggie Gallagher as Maggie Srivastav? For some reason she doesn't use her husband's (and her legal) name even though she's supposedly a big fan of traditional marriage. Is she legally married or not, and where is her husband in all of this? Is Mrs. Raman Srivastav a.k.a. Margaret Gallagher Srivastav a.k.a. Maggie Gallagher embarrassed by her husband's foreign-sounding name? Or maybe he's embarrassed by her, and has asked her not to use it?

  • 70. Ed  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:08 am

    Umm….So I just looked at the numbers for California. Seems more people voted for/against Prop 8 than people voting for the governor's race…..
    U *know* NOM is gonna spin this into outer space…..

  • 71. Jim  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:09 am

    Regarding Iowa: Obama now has three excellent, impartial state judges to consider for appointments to the federal bench.

  • 72. Ronnie  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:13 am

    Here is the video of New York Senator Kristen Gillibrand's victory speech that included "I want to see made in America again"….I couldn't agree more…..

    "We must protect civil rights for ALL Americans. That means FULL Marriage Equality & Men & Women can serve in our military & cannot be dismissed for who they love."

    <3..Ronnie:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gzRTXt8Rwrc&fe

  • 73. Kate  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:16 am

    Or maybe it's a Green Card "marriage?"

  • 74. Jim  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:18 am

    With 100% of precincts reporting, anti-gay bully Pugno LOST, getting just 46% of vote, allowing Democrats to take over a Republican seat in California State Assembly.
    http://vote.sos.ca.gov/returns/state-assembly/dis

  • 75. Michael Ejercito  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:19 am

    The next time the justices issue an equal protection decision, maybe they should really define equal protection by the standards of the current generation. ( Varnum v. Brien )

  • 76. Straight Ally #3008  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:20 am

    Installing someone as a judge mainly because they will march in lock-step to your fundamentalist ideology rather than be beholden to a constitution strikes me as almost totalitarian.

    I went way over the top in my example, but I was mad.

  • 77. Richard A. Walter (s  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:20 am

    And I thought the people of Iowa were smart enough to realize that NOM and their cronies and hags were only using fear tactics. NOM also managed to scare people into electing the governor and other offices the way NOM wanted them to be, freedom be damned! Look for marriage equality in Iowa to end very soon. NOM, you and your ilk are a complete and total shanda der menchen!

  • 78. Straight Ally #3008  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:21 am

    HAPPY HAPPY JOY JOY!!!!

    Sorry, Andrew…
    http://www.sadtrombone.com/

  • 79. Straight Ally #3008  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:23 am

    +1000

    This idea needs to be spread!

  • 80. Michael Ejercito  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:23 am

    Preserving the traditional and historical definition of marriage appeals beyond the conservatives and religious.

    Let me tell you of this place called Maine .

  • 81. Straight Ally #3008  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:23 am

    She's gonna go far(ther)

  • 82. Linda  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:24 am

    Kathleen…I agree; bullying at its most effective. I am concerned about the steamroll effect as we head towards the 2012 elections.

  • 83. Straight Ally #3008  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:26 am

    Ugh. Teabagger Paul LePage is now governor of Maine.

    I donated to the No on 1 campaign and was crushed when it failed, but with LePage in office, there's no chance of marriage equality by legislative action for the next for years, it would only be possible through another ballot initiative.

    Terrible news – I feel awful for the Maine LGBT community. :-(

  • 84. Mark  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:28 am

    This is some of the saddest election day news so far. This is quickly becoming an extremist nation.

  • 85. Straight Ally #3008  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:28 am

    Richard, remember that the current governor appoints their replacements – they may have done nothing more but exercise their scare tactics to no avail. I'm half-following the developments, so perhaps another P8TTer can correct me.

    Hang in there, Richard!

  • 86. Ronnie  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:30 am

    Maybe the Justices should abide by the Constitution & not religious dictatorship…oh wait that is what they did…& you repugnant un-American Homophobic pigs personally attacked them because they wouldn't bow down to you…I mean your theocratic dictatorship agenda….go away faux lawyer…. >I …Ronnie

  • 87. icapricorn  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:32 am

    Ah yes, "the higher ground." That's where you stand when the battle is won, when thanks are being extended and backs are being patted. It wasn't the higher ground where Rosa Park sat but at the front of the bus until she was hauled off by policemen and booked in jail. It wasn't the safe, august higher ground when MLK stood when he marched his crew through Southern cities to the cries of "communist agitator."

    I do see that I overreacted in my first comment due perhaps to the bad loses we suffered last night. Deflating the tires (or worse) on the NOM buses would only feed into their upside down narrative that they're the victims and we're the ones with the agenda. Clearly it is the other way around.

    However, a little street theater is in order. Laying down in front of the buses so they can't move, say. That would give the news media a high-impact photo to hang a story on, a hook for a event that would otherwise be unremarkable and unreported. With such a picture, a reporter would be provided the space in the paper or on TV to mention the disparity in numbers between pro and con supporters, the absurd soundbites, the content-less talking points. Items that in themselves do not generate media attention.

    We have to make NOM feel the heat too. We have to provide disincentives for their supporters. Standing on higher ground is premature right now. I say, silence = death.

  • 88. fiona64  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:33 am

    Which "traditional and historical definition of marriage," Michael?

    The one in which a woman was handed over a chattel to seal a legal contract between two families? The one in which a woman had no legal identity of her own (look up the word "coverture")? The one in which a man could rape a woman, pay her father 50 pieces of silver, and marry her since no one was harmed once the property had been bought and paid for? The one in which people of different ethnicities are not allowed to marry?

    Let me tell you of this place called REALITY, Michael. The "traditional and historical definition of marriage" has changed repeatedly throughout time and culture. It is NOT a static institution.

  • 89. Gregory in Salt Lake  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:36 am

    Thanks elliom….I'll stop by : D

  • 90. fiona64  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:37 am

    Well, Michael … I hate to tell you this — but those judges did just what they were appointed to do. They reviewed a law for constitutionality and it failed the test. This was a unanimous finding.

    There is no rational basis for denying marriage to same-sex couples. That means there is no compelling state interest in doing so — which means that to do so is unconstitutional.

    I am beginning to think you lied about attending college and that you are, in fact, a home-schooled teenager.

  • 91. fiona64  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:38 am

    These Teabirchers scare the crap out of me … even more so because people don't apply critical thinking and believe the bee-ess that they spew.

    I fear for this country with the Religious Reich gaining power.

    Republic of Gilead FTL.

  • 92. Gregory in Salt Lake  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:41 am

    oh! who knows?!

  • 93. Trish  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:42 am

    Really, Michael? You site to another posting by yourself? Why not just repost it? The off-site links are for actual evidence that you're presenting to back up your arguments, not to make another of your own arguments supported by your own argument.

  • 94. Ronnie  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:44 am

    No it appeals to Fascist selfish un-American, in human pigs like you who think you own the world & are under the delusional impression that you have the right to control every aspect of our personal lives & force us to live our lives how you want us too…. > I …..Ronnie

  • 95. Richard A. Walter (s  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:45 am

    I am trying to Straight Ally #3008, but when I see this nation heading in the direction of becoming the living embodiment of The Handmaid's Tale, it is very difficult to do. Effective immediately, I am increasing my already intense efforts to make sure that every LGBT American and every one of our allies gets out and votes in EVERY election from here on out, so that we can stop this chain of events from playing out to the destruction of this country.

  • 96. Richard A. Walter (s  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:50 am

    Sister Ejercitop, why don't you go back under the rock you crawled out from, and remain there until you finish your development into what is supposed to be a human being? Right now you are proving that you are nothing more tghan the mindless sheep that believe all of NOM's lies, along with the lies of Sister Tony Perkins, and Miss James Dobson, Porno Pete LaBarbera, and that you yourself have something to hide, otherwise, you would not be attacking those of us who are comfortable enough in our own skins and our own humanity to be willing to put everything on the line to gain our full equality and our full civil and human rights. And it scares you, because you think that we are not human, and you know that once it becomes apparent that we are human, that your cyberbullying and other hate-filled criminal tactics will no longer be tolerated in civilized society, and that will cause you to lose what little bit of false power you currently think you have.

  • 97. Michael Ejercito  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:50 am

    Yes, traditions change; the tradition I have referred to, and which the voters of Maine had chosen to preserve (at least until the next legislative session) was a tradition that dates back to the time of King James I.

  • 98. Michael Ejercito  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:52 am

    No it appeals to Fascist selfish un-American, in human pigs like you who think you own the world & are under the delusional impression that you have the right to control every aspect of our personal lives & force us to live our lives how you want us too…. > I …..Ronnie

    There are not enough fascists in Maine to fill a school bus.

  • 99. Michael Ejercito  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:55 am

    From p. 16 of Varnum v. Brien

    For sure, our nation has struggled to achieve a broad national
    consensus on equal protection of the laws when it has been forced to apply
    that principle to some of the institutions, traditions, and norms woven into
    the fabric of our society. This observation is important today because it
    reveals equal protection can only be defined by the standards of each
    generation
    .

    Do you get that? The standards of each generation .

    Well, under the Varnum doctrine, the current generation of Iowans enforced their standards.

  • 100. Michael Ejercito  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:57 am

    So much hyperbole, despite the fact that I had not called any of the commenters a derogatory name.

  • 101. Richard A. Walter (s  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:57 am

    Who was himself a closet queen, and who increased the number of redactions in his "Authorized version" of the scriptures in 1611, which were further redacted, misquoted, and mistranslated when this version was re-edited in 1789. And it is this 1789 revision that is commonly called the KJV. So Queen James I is totally irrelevant, Sister Ejercito!

  • 102. Ronnie  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:57 am

    MAUDE!!!!!!… Oh you mean the school bus you would use to run over LGBT people while using a bull horn to tell LGBT teens to go ahead & kill themselves….because your side is filled with nothing but murder & violence advocating, fostering, & enabling trash bags?

    > I …Ronnie

  • 103. Ronnie  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:58 am

    Debiel….. > I …Ronnie

  • 104. Ronnie  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:59 am

    GO AWAY!!!!!!……. > I ….Ronnie

  • 105. Richard A. Walter (s  |  November 3, 2010 at 3:01 am

    Actually, one of Nobel Prize winning writers stated during the time of the Harlem Renaissance that "When Fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and toting the Bible. Since you have wrapped yourself in the flag and have been thumping your Bible in everyone of your posts, you have just proven those words to be true. That being said, this proves that there are more fascists in Maine than you would have us to believe. But see, you are trying to preach to a group of people who actually have fully-developed critical thinking skills, who know what their brain is actually intended to be used for, and who will not just blindly follow you down the road to perdition and destruction. So, you really need to come out of your little closet, smell the latte, and move into the real world and the current century.

  • 106. Andrew Adaro  |  November 3, 2010 at 3:02 am

    I'm not sure if NOM's scare tactics will work… the judges knew they were putting their jobs on the line by doing what was right.

    Judges who didn't sympathize with us before will stay the same.

    Judges who are willing to risk their jobs in the name of justice will stay the same.

    I doubt the number of judges who lie inbetween are very common, at least on the state supreme court level.

  • 107. Michael Ejercito  |  November 3, 2010 at 3:03 am

    What is Governor-elect Paul Le Page's stance on same sex marriage?

    I have read other sources indicating that he does not oppose same sex civil unions.

  • 108. Ronnie  |  November 3, 2010 at 3:04 am

    What gives you the right, Michael Ejerkcito, to force me to live my life according to your "traditions"?….You are infringing on my right to life, liberty, & the pursuit of happiness, my freedom of expression, my freedom of religion, my freedom of speech, my FREEDOM to be how nature made me by forcing me to live life how you demand I live it…You are disgusting..no better then a slave driver…

    >I …Ronnie

  • 109. Richard A. Walter (s  |  November 3, 2010 at 3:05 am

    NO, you have only used your comments as verbal slaps in the face and attempts to inject your feeling of superiority over us. You have really shown your true colors every time you have posted, and you only refer back to "arguments" you yourself have made, because when it comes right down to it, then those who are using actual logic refute everything you say. Why don't you go back to playing with your NOMbie friends and leave the adults alone?

  • 110. Gregory in Salt Lake  |  November 3, 2010 at 3:06 am

    "Religious Reich" I agree…VERY scary : ( religious persons are trained to agree and say "Hallelujah!" to anything their leaders say…without questioning validity or reason. I used to be one of those….shudder.

    Late last night an Aging Tom Brokaw declared that the tea party winners make claims need more jobs w/out any apparent plan to create jobs…. I found his comment very insightful. The TB's just say a bunch of stuff like "we need to take our country back"(from who? maybe the native Americans or some Hispanic persons could rightfully claim as much?) , "need more jobs" and icky comments about LGBTQ persons. Bizarre how they get elected. (shaking head…..)

  • 111. Anonygrl  |  November 3, 2010 at 3:06 am

    If YOU are in Maine, Micheal, then there are one too many facists there, I believe is Ronnie's point.

    "Traditional marriage", dating back to King James, included the idea that a woman could not own property, that any familial inheritance she might get was instead given her husband, that he could beat her with a stick if he chose, that she was his property.

    Not the "traditional marriage" we have today. And as has always been the case, the traditions are growing and changing. When was the last time you heard of a woman coming with a dowry? How many girls sit at home and weave linens for their hope chests?

    The good news is that society as a whole can and does grow and learn. Which we are doing now. A painful process, perhaps, but worth it in the end. Equality is going to happen, whether this year or not, but one day soon you will find that your "traditional marriage" includes same sex couples. You can complain, or you can get over your prejudice and move on to something that really matters.

    Maybe you could do something about hunger in third world nations?

  • 112. Ronnie  |  November 3, 2010 at 3:07 am

    Separate but Equal is not Equal…Marriage only…don't infringe on my freedom of expression, speech, religion, life, liberty & pursuit of happiness… > I …Ronnie

  • 113. Richard A. Walter (s  |  November 3, 2010 at 3:08 am

    Civil unnions and marriage are two different things, and has been proven numerous times in the history of this great nation, separate but equal is NOT equal. What part of FULL Equality and FULL civil and human rights seems to escape the two brain cells you have left?

  • 114. Gregory in Salt Lake  |  November 3, 2010 at 3:12 am

    Ditto! I'm sure you could find more sympathetic audiences elsewhere Michael….

    If you really are interested in the law, here is a masterful case for you to learn from: http://www.scribd.com/doc/35374462/California-Pro

  • 115. Ann S.  |  November 3, 2010 at 3:16 am

    :(

  • 116. jim  |  November 3, 2010 at 3:16 am

    Sadly, both houses of legislature turned GOP :-(

  • 117. jim  |  November 3, 2010 at 3:18 am

    But sadly, both houses of the legislature went to the GOP :-(

  • 118. Rightthingtodo TX  |  November 3, 2010 at 3:18 am

    you're implicitly defining "generational standards" as "will of the people". fail.

  • 119. karen in kalifornia  |  November 3, 2010 at 3:22 am

    Unfortunately…next stop for NOM to spread it's anti gay discrimination are North Carolina, New Hampshire, Minnesota, and back to Iowa. All these states now have Repugs in control of both houses (well not iowa) and marriage amendment will show up in NC; legislation rescinding equality in NH, and amendment in MN. Who knows what's next in Iowa. Also Pennsylvania now controlled by Repugs. No equality to show up there soon.

  • 120. jon  |  November 3, 2010 at 3:29 am

    Can the nonpartisan commission in IA select the same judges to submit for approval? I didn't see anything about that not being allowed at this site:
    http://www.iowacourtsonline.org/Public_Informatio

  • 121. fiona64  |  November 3, 2010 at 3:29 am

    Rosa Parks did not get down into the mud and use tactics of fear or intimidation.

    Neither did MLK.

    Neither did Gandhi.

  • 122. fiona64  |  November 3, 2010 at 3:32 am

    Michael Ejercito wrote: "Yes, traditions change; the tradition I have referred to, and which the voters of Maine had chosen to preserve (at least until the next legislative session) was a tradition that dates back to the time of King James I."

    Ah. So you believe in all of the traditions that I cited.

    Gotcha.

    Is it any wonder that you're single?

  • 123. fiona64  |  November 3, 2010 at 3:34 am

    Yes, Michael — they did indeed use the standards of this generation.

    That's why marriage equality still stands in Iowa, you insipid git.

  • 124. Jyo  |  November 3, 2010 at 3:35 am

    the traditional and historical definition of marriage

    Michael: Your tradition and my tradition are very different. Let me tell you about my tradition:

    My parents had one of the most solid and loving marriages I've ever witnessed. Even after my father was diagnosed with a life-altering illness, my mother stood loyally by him — at first, helping to pick up a crutch he had knocked over so that he could stand, then pushing him around in a wheelchair, then changing his bedpans when he could no longer do even that for himself, and then in his last year, waking up several times a night to turn him so that he wouldn't get bedsores. She stood by him, steadfastly, and never let it break her loving spirit.

    In my tradition, the definition of marriage speaks of open communication, an aspiration to lifelong commitment, a pledge to support one another "in sickness and in health", and deep devotion and trust in one another.

    Your definition involves nothing more than counting peepees and hoohoos. If there's one of each, that's good enough for you.

    I think your definition of marriage is both empty and sad.

  • 125. fiona64  |  November 3, 2010 at 3:37 am

    You don't have to call people names in order to spew hate speech, little man.

    In fact, in your case, it appears that you only need open your mouth and have sound come out (or put fingers to keyboard, as it were).

    Why don't you go and color while the adults talk?

  • 126. book in Tracy  |  November 3, 2010 at 3:43 am

    That would be a great 'message', but am afraid it would play right into the NOM-view of subverting the will of the people! There must be great equality–minded judges to nominate. Hopefully a great deal of education of the public as to what really happened will prevent an oncore performance,

  • 127. jon  |  November 3, 2010 at 3:50 am

    I agree and the gov. wouldn't pick them anyway. The system is stupid anyway. Unless the judges did something illegal they shouldn't have to vote on retention.

    I hope this encourages other judges to rule against discrimination all that much more!

  • 128. jon  |  November 3, 2010 at 3:58 am

    What I'm most frustrated about with this whole issue is how the likes of nom keep telling the lie that "the will of the people" is the absolute final say on everything in the US.

    It's not. The Constitution is supposed to allow for fairness and equality for all of us regardless of the popular opinion when it comes to basic rights.

    I'm so tired of the public ignorance and the people who support that to further their goals of discrimination.

  • 129. Bob Barnes  |  November 3, 2010 at 4:02 am

    Fiona, me like.

  • 130. jim  |  November 3, 2010 at 4:06 am

    Yea right, the IRS won't even go after pastors advocating candidates or the repub. party from the pulpit. If they go after nom, their faithful will just give more money. :-(

  • 131. Bob Barnes  |  November 3, 2010 at 4:17 am

    Michael Ejercito,

    Isn't nice that we play fair and allow other voices here? No one here is going to censor you. Several others including myself have been banned from the NOMblogs. I was block just for posting links that debunk Samantha's constant "gays are pedophiles" post.

    Funny how people at NOM claim to love the first amendment and honesty, but show neither.

  • 132. Bob  |  November 3, 2010 at 4:54 am

    well said Icapricorn,,, I remember very well the work of ACT-UP, during the Aids crisis, people were dying all around us, and we were told it was the will of God. there was no time for explaining, that we deserved better treatment, or even trying to argue our case that the religious right had it wrong.

    There was simply a conviction inside that people were suffering, and we fought to alleviate that. The reaction to injustice was simply to ACT-UP, make a noise, as friends lay in hospital beds dying, we would get comfort from watching a news cast of that rowdy group, who had again chained themelves to a building, or blocked the streets. Those actions brought comfort and hope on a spiritual level, and it was amazing how at times it just seemed to be an outward extenson of an individuals internal fight to accept and love themselves while dying.

    It helped us all in our convictions that we were and are lovable, to see people on the street fighting for us.

    During that time, the only higher ground, was a place of denial, one either waded into the trenches of the aids wards in hospitals, with their friends, or ignored them, and hoped it wouldn't happen to you. To bring yourself into the wards with your friends put you in the trenches, cause even there we had to battle discrimination and hatred

    What I found personally from years of being in those trenches, was that overwhelming sense of strength in the face of adversty, there were angles present, and eventually you could see them stand out in stark contrast to the extreme hatred and loathing that was plentiful, those people (angles) held us up, and so we were then on a higher ground, but only on a spiritual emotional level.. which gave us the strength to stand up for our friends, and demand they be treated as humans.

    In that environment of stench of death, bodily fluids , bed pans, delisional fevers, we learned to love, both give and recieve, like I for one had never known before. Yes in the face of all the ignorance and bigotry, hatred, and prejudice, love broke through. Both inside our own individual hearts, and outside on a grander scale due to the actions of ACT-UP,

    What I am trying to say, is that the higher ground is only in your mind, and be careful that the ego does not lead you into believing that you are someway superior to another, by your thinkiing or your actions. The higher ground only comes from first acting equal, on a very human level, yes physical, see feel hear smell touch, be, equal, forget the legal mumbo jumbo, let go of the political majority strength idea, and just act. Act first, the other things fall into place,
    We could not wait for politics, or beliefs to change in order to comfort and love our friends, the act of loving was witnessed by many who never saw men loving each other. The act of love cannot be hidden from view, when I crawled in bed to hold my dying friend it was simply an instinct on my part, but sent shivers through those nursers who were themselves reliigious bigots, and filed complaints,

    I would caution anyone who is looking to take the moral high ground. In most cases it is just a way of not getting dirty. It's the same as the nurses who insisted on wearing full masks gowns and gloves to attend to my friend, even though we were well beyond that necessity in the struggle. I called them on it and hospital authorities ruled in our favour, any nurse that choose that moral high ground to distance herself was offered the opportunity to offer her services on another ward, or in a different hospital. No more face masks , aids was not airborn.

    In this present battle with NOM I would think it does no good to use persuasive arguments, to try and jusitfy our life as humans on this planet. I say in order for us to survive and love each other we need to lay down in front of the bus, Stop the disease of hatred rolling around on that bus, because it kills. In order to comfort each other we need to stop the bus, not try and convince others of our worth, and there need to protect us. Having the courage to confront evil ourselves and clear our path to equality, as dirty and humble as it is becomes the moral high ground, and once we stand their others will see it.

    I am angered by the thought that the U.S. sets an example by changing power in gov't without a single shot being fired. First I would ask if any of those teen suicides was from gunshot.

    There is already bloodshed in our fight to equality, anyone who thinks there is not is in denial. Taking the moral high ground in this situation involves using leagal arguments, and politiclal goals rather than throwing ourselves infront of the bus, while our children are dying.

    ACT-UP was America's response to the situation at the time, and it changed the world, There was much negative reaction to this approach, initially, but it came from the heart of Rainbow people, and created a movement that went global, and is still used and highly respected today.

    To that Philip guy, who posted, I am hungry, can you feed me, cause by doing so you will be learning and loving, and it will transform you, Don't be afraid, gay people are going to change America, and in the process things will break apart, and you will have to let go of how things are, but in the process you will have helped humanity.

    .

  • 133. Steve  |  November 3, 2010 at 5:15 am

    Exactly. The "will of the people" is irrelevant when it comes to civil rights and minority rights.

    Pure democracy is five foxes and two chickens voting on what's for dinner. It obviously doesn't work in anything but a very small and local level.

  • 134. Michael Ejercito  |  November 3, 2010 at 5:17 am

    MAUDE!!!!!!… Oh you mean the school bus you would use to run over LGBT people while using a bull horn to tell LGBT teens to go ahead & kill themselves….because your side is filled with nothing but murder & violence advocating, fostering, & enabling trash bags?

    > I …Ronnie

    I have never told people to kill themselves because they were LGBT.

  • 135. Steve  |  November 3, 2010 at 5:18 am

    They tried the civil union thing in New Jersey when the legislature was order to either offer that or marriage. It didn't really work. Numerous institutions and companies refused to honor civil unions and people still weren't treated equally.

    Besides, why offer exactly the same rights simply under a different name? (assuming CUs are absolutely equal, which isn't always the case). Just simplify it and call it what it is: marriage

  • 136. Michael Ejercito  |  November 3, 2010 at 5:20 am

    And here is another case.
    http://caselaw.findlaw.com/tx-court-of-appeals/15

  • 137. Michael Ejercito  |  November 3, 2010 at 5:21 am

    So how would you measure generational standards?

  • 138. JonT  |  November 3, 2010 at 5:22 am

    I agree with both of your points Jeffery. If the NOMbies want to drive around every state and spend money trying to intimidate judges, let them try.

    We know their goal is to try to instill fear, but it did not do so in the Iowa judges case, I do not think it will, anywhere else either.

  • 139. JonT  |  November 3, 2010 at 5:24 am

    '…and to add insult to injury we will never hear the end of the gloating over it from NOM and their anti-gay cronies'

    Oh well what else is new. They always do that, so do we. Besides, as you point out, yesterday was hardly a sweeping victory for them.

  • 140. JonT  |  November 3, 2010 at 5:27 am

    'I have compassion for those who suffer from any kind of disorder, there is no reason to ever hate anyone for choices they make.'

    That's sweet of you dear, but being gay isn't a disorder, nor is it a choice.

    'I believe our country is being destroyed by this gay movement, our social fabric is being torn apart.'

    What does that even mean? Care to elaborate?

    'I am not talking religion of any kind.'

    Oh, I'd bet money you are.

    The rest of your post doesn't make much sense to me, but at least you seem to believe in evolution. Good for you!

  • 141. Ronnie  |  November 3, 2010 at 5:32 am

    Mihcael Ejerkcito is enn Homofobisch Duidelijk tragel is Duidelijk… ; ) …Ronnie

  • 142. JonT  |  November 3, 2010 at 5:33 am

    I like that… :)

  • 143. Ronnie  |  November 3, 2010 at 5:33 am

    I didn't say you did, you benighted troglodyte…learn how to f@#king read moron…. >( …Ronnie

  • 144. Ronnie  |  November 3, 2010 at 5:40 am

    Equality not Heterosexual Homophobic supremacy….sounds like pretty good & decent human standards to me…. ; ) …Ronnie

  • 145. fiona64  |  November 3, 2010 at 5:41 am

    Michael Ejercito wrote: " I have never told people to kill themselves because they were LGBT."

    Which makes it all okay in your mind, right? Because saying that same-sex couples are not capable of loving each other in the same way as opposite-sex couples (which you did indeed say) could not possibly be the proverbial last straw that some young, struggling GLBT person reads on a day where he or she has been beaten up, thrown out of the house, raped, etc.

    Just because you don't call names and shout like Clint McCance doesn't change the fact that your speech is hate speech, rooted in nothing but fear and ignorance.

  • 146. JonT  |  November 3, 2010 at 5:46 am

    '…remember that the current governor appoints their replacements…'

    Although I'm fairly sure this isn't allowed, it would be funny if the governor simply re-appointed them :)

  • 147. JonT  |  November 3, 2010 at 5:50 am

    '…scare the crap out of me'

    Ah but fiona, unlike in the election where they could avoid media scrutiny, now these morons have to actually govern.

  • 148. JonT  |  November 3, 2010 at 5:52 am

    Please do not feed the trolls.

  • 149. JonT  |  November 3, 2010 at 5:56 am

    I agree with all of your points.

    They (the judges) also made no effort to defend themselves. That says something of their character by itself.

  • 150. Phillip R  |  November 3, 2010 at 5:56 am

    Well, it's unfortunate but can't say I'm too surprised. Power swapping tends to happen during midterm elections.

    Down with the tea party though…those people are scary.

  • 151. Buffy  |  November 3, 2010 at 5:57 am

    Whose idea of "traditional marriage" are you talking about? That "one man, one woman" thing isn't as "traditional" as you like to claim it is. Go do some actual research and your eyes will be opened.

  • 152. Steve  |  November 3, 2010 at 6:01 am

    It's obvious that current western society has a far greater acceptance of homosexuality than was the case in for example the 50s and 60s. There is also a clear generational divide with younger people being largely indifferent. It's self-evident that society has changed its opinion on this topic. Even very much so over the last 20 years alone.

    What you can't do is have an exact vote to determine when a minority has become accepted enough to deserve equality under the law.

  • 153. JonT  |  November 3, 2010 at 6:02 am

    'What I’m most frustrated about with this whole issue is how the likes of nom keep telling the lie that “the will of the people” is the absolute final say on everything in the US.'

    Oh, that will change as the "Will of the People" goes against them, as it eventually will.

  • 154. icapricorn  |  November 3, 2010 at 7:22 am

    Thank you Bob. I see you went through it like I did. I was a volunteer in a dedicated AIDS ward at St. Clare's Hospital, the only one of its kind in New York City at the time, where all the patients with AIDS were put on one floor, and all the nurses that worked with them had asked to be there.

    Some of these nurses were nuns (out of habit you'd never know except for conversations we have in the nurses lounge, which was open to the volunteers.) Never ONCE did I hear anything but love and compassion from any of the nurses, doctors or interns I worked alongside. About 40% of my fellow volunteers were straight women, some of them joining us after sitting at the hospital bedside of a dying friend.

    There was one case where a patient was moved to a different floor. Then I saw the hostility you described: the nurses with the unnecessary masks. In fact, the room was filthy; I suspected the interns skipped it. I was glad when this patient was brought back up to our floor where he died in something approximating peace. Anyway, after about a year and half of that, I burnt out big time, as was par for volunteers in terminal units. I was really ready for some screaming in the streets and ACT UP gave me the release I needed.

    Thank you for acknowledging and understanding where I was coming from in my first comment.

  • 155. Mackenzie  |  November 3, 2010 at 7:36 am

    let them use it…..we have our case for Prop8 in federal courts…..good thing that they are never up for an election.

  • 156. wren  |  November 3, 2010 at 8:12 am

    I totally agree. F*ck the high road. As Queer Nation used to say "Queers Bash Back"!

  • 157. Straight Ally #3008  |  November 3, 2010 at 8:22 am

    Sweet, sweet, poetic justice! ;-D

  • 158. Bennett  |  November 3, 2010 at 8:27 am

    What else will be sacrificed in the final death throes of inequality in the United States? Our democracy and our independent judiciary are the latest casualties.

    A glimmer of hope. We couldnt afford to lose Harry Reid and we didn't.

    I just hope Sharon calls for a recount or something and doesnt go right for the second ammendment rememdies.

    Thank God my passport finally showed up!

  • 159. Straight Ally #3008  |  November 3, 2010 at 8:33 am

    They have to work fast, since the tide of public opinion is steadily turning against them. And I think the little f—ers know it.

  • 160. nightshayde  |  November 3, 2010 at 8:44 am

    I'm thinking, though, that they SHOULD have defended themselves — even if only in 30-second-long civics lessons. They wouldn't have had to attack NOM. They could have just reminded Iowans that they were doing their job, that they made their decision based on the evidence submitted at trial, and that ruling based on evidence presented rather than on religious beliefs is EXACTLY what they're supposed to do.

  • 161. Bennett  |  November 3, 2010 at 8:44 am

    NOM is like a surfer claiming to have made the waves. Why does the phrase "It's he economy stupid!" come to mind, did I hear that somewhere?

  • 162. Ann S.  |  November 3, 2010 at 8:50 am

    To do that they have to spend money. Which normally means that they have to raise money. Which means that they have to take campaign contributions.

    THAT is one of the biggest evils about judicial elections.

  • 163. Straight Ally #3008  |  November 3, 2010 at 9:06 am

    A song for NOM:

    They say there are strangers who threaten us
    Our immigrants and infidels
    They say there is strangeness, too dangerous
    In our theatres and bookstore shelves
    That those who know what's best for us
    Must rise and save us from ourselves

    Quick to judge
    Quick to anger
    Slow to understand

    Ignorance and prejudice
    And fear
    Walk hand in hand

    -"Witch Hunt," Rush

  • 164. Straight Ally #3008  |  November 3, 2010 at 9:07 am

    Michael, man, just come on out and say it: "I hate faggots."

  • 165. Bob  |  November 3, 2010 at 9:13 am

    you take the high road I'll take the low road, and I'll get to Scotland afore yee!!!

    Rosa Parks was on a bus, no mud, but she did ignore strict laws of conduct , and positioned herself to fluant those laws, shoved it in their face she did, in such a way that got messy and made them carry her off the bus, physcial interaction….which stirred everyones emotions evoking fear intimidation, and lot's of follow up action of smilar kind, she messed things up and got the ball rolling.

    MLK most certainly took up the fight, and led crowds through messy streets of fire hoses and dogs, I'm sure there was mud involved there, and lots of fear and intimidation,,, he walked through it,,,,,,,,,and eventually took a bullet for his actions, there was blood.

    Ghandi did in deed lay down in the dirt, and his followers did the same, en mass to stop the advancing army on horseback, oh they were in the mud, and laid their life on the line.

    @Wren fuck the high road indeed once action is taken, very quickly they change the rules and laws to accomodate the new reality, as they did in all the cases above,

    @Mackenzie, we do indeed have our case for Prop8 and we stand a very good chance at winning, but you see how tight the situation was, has it been decided yet who the new governor is???

    work all ends to a central goal,,,,,

  • 166. nightshayde  |  November 3, 2010 at 9:23 am

    I wouldn't measure generational standards. Discrimination is wrong whether based in religion, tradition, ignorance, or any combination thereof.

    "Because it's always been that way" is not a valid reason for denying basic civil rights to any segment of the population. Nor is "some people find those people icky."

  • 167. nightshayde  |  November 3, 2010 at 9:23 am

    Awwww. Even though I'm an adult, I love to color!

    May I color while we talk? =)

  • 168. nightshayde  |  November 3, 2010 at 9:25 am

    Hmmm. Good point. Perhaps a 3rd party should have come in to do the dirty cleansing work.

    Aaaah. 20/20 hindsight. >.<

  • 169. fiona64  |  November 3, 2010 at 9:29 am

    But … but … SA#3008! Michael doesn't hate anyone! Just ask him! Not once has he called anyone names or told GLBT people to kill themselves! That means his hate speech is just peachy. Just ask him!

    My money is actually on Michael hating *himself,* because he's a closet case.

  • 170. fiona64  |  November 3, 2010 at 9:31 am

    Hell, I'll bring the crayons and the "color your own Renoir masterpiece" book. :-)

    Perhaps I should have suggested that Mikey go play with his Tonka toys instead. After all, coloring may be too "girly" for our resident, self-proclaimed he-man.

    Heh.

    Love,
    Fiona

  • 171. Aaron  |  November 3, 2010 at 9:52 am

    how often does MN vote for legislature? can we undo this in 2012?

  • 172. Aaron  |  November 3, 2010 at 9:53 am

    HOW?

  • 173. Gregory in Salt Lake  |  November 3, 2010 at 10:04 am

    Great Example Michael! :) It is a PERFECT example of how LGBTQ persons get treated separate and supremely unequally. We want to be protected in divorce as well as in marriage….nothing changes for opposite sex marriages….just treat us the same.

    I challenge you to actually read the case you posted and I DOUBLY challenge you to read every word and understand Judge Walker's ruling. It is one thing to declare "activist judge" like a mimicking parrot….its another to learn why formally opposing attorneys Ted Olson and David Boies joined forces:
    http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/02262010/profil

    ….and why Boies says the promise of equal rights can and should be argued from all sides of the political spectrum:

    "It's baked into the soul of America. Our spotted history in actually delivering on that promise has always come from the failure of people to really see someone else as human. But once you accept someone as 'like us' then discriminating against them becomes untenable."
    http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/02262010/profil

  • 174. Gregory in Salt Lake  |  November 3, 2010 at 10:11 am

    corrected 2nd link:
    http://www.newsweek.com/2010/01/11/gay-marriage-t

  • 175. Gregory Enke  |  November 3, 2010 at 10:19 am

    LOL! Oh Fiona, (and Ronnie!) your choice of words cause me fits of spontaneous giddiness :)

    "insipid git"

  • 176. JonT  |  November 3, 2010 at 10:19 am

    Awesome choice SG3008!

    Here is an attempt at a youtube embed:

    [youtube =http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6gHKNwpny9o&fs=1&hl=en_US]

  • 177. grod  |  November 3, 2010 at 10:39 am

    @ John B
    Thank you for your reflection of the larger picture. It is interesting to also reflect on the bigger picture ably painted by Icapricorn. At bottom, in Maine, Rhode Island, New York, California, Washington and now Iowa, NOM has been manipulating the legal system to its advantage. This time they reached into the judicary itself, hoping to intimidate judges across America. When will the long or short arm of the law, or IRS catch up with them? And how can CCI, indeed the LGBT community, further mobilize to ensure that "catching up' happens sooner than later?

  • 178. Gregory in Salt Lake  |  November 3, 2010 at 10:41 am

    Great comments JonT

    " it would be funny if the governor simply re-appointed them…"

    That would be AWESOME!

    and

    …"now these morons have to actually govern."

    This will be VERY interesting. aka "Impaled upon your own sword, Gilderoy!" –Dumbledore in the "Chamber of Secrets" (Harry Potter book #2)

  • 179. anonygrl  |  November 3, 2010 at 11:06 am

    Lying down in the mud is not taking the low road. In fact, I think it IS the high road in many cases. Sometimes the most noble thing you CAN do is lie down in front of the approaching tanks.

    When I think of the low road, I think of deception, cheating, hurting people, stealing, flaunting the law, doing deliberate harm in the name of whatever good you think you will accomplish. And THAT is a road I am unwilling to take.

    I will protest. I will shout. I will be loud and angry. I will fight back, I will insist on a seat in the front of the bus. I will stand in front of the approaching army unarmed and not let them pass. None of those things is the low road.

    I will not lie about them. I will not firebomb them. I will not prevaricate in the press about their personal lives. I will not play dirty politics, I will not restrict their rights. I will not support organizations that do. These, to me, are the low road I won't take. And if it takes me longer to get to Scotland, and if I arrive mud spattered, broke, or even broken, I will still be ME, and that makes all the difference.

  • 180. Gregory in Salt Lake  |  November 3, 2010 at 11:10 am

    Thank you for that anonygrl….the past 24 hours have been joy and despair but your post invoked sobbing, determined tears. Love, Gregory

  • 181. JonT  |  November 3, 2010 at 11:12 am

    @Anonygrl:

    +1

  • 182. Paul in Minneapolis  |  November 3, 2010 at 12:01 pm

    We could be in trouble here in Minnesota.

    As has already been noted, republican majorities have been elected to both the Minnesota House and Senate.

    The Minnesota constitution can be amended if both legislative chambers approve a proposed amendment by simple majorities, and if a simple majority of voters subsequently approves the proposed amendment in the next general election.

    The governor need not have anything to do with it.

    We all know that NOM will push the republican-controlled Minnesota legislature to pass an anti-equality marriage amendment. With a simple majority being all it takes to send the amendment to the voters, and with a majority of voters here likely to vote for such an amendment, I am not optimistic about the fate of marriage equality in Minnesota.

  • 183. Richard A. Walter (s  |  November 3, 2010 at 12:29 pm

    So Minnesota and North Carolina are in the same boat, then. The RepubliCANTS took over both houses here also. Add to that the fact that we are in the Bible belt, and the LGBT community, the Jews, and the Muslims don't stand a chance of any real equality any time soon!

  • 184. grod  |  November 3, 2010 at 12:40 pm

    @ Michael
    Let me tell you about Maine's neighbour to the north (Quebec) and to the east (New Brunswick). Better still, let me tell you about all of Canada, including the territory next to Alaska. Except for Quebec, our legal system is rooted in the same traditions as is yours. We share the same or similar life styles and religious traditions. In a sense, Canadians are a mirror to yourselves.

    Between 2003 and 2005 courts in 8/10 provinces (including Quebec) and 1/3 territories found in favour of SSM. In 2005, via legislation approved in the federal houses of parliament, SSM was extended everywhere.

    At base, the same concerns expressed by you and others (i.e NOM), were expressed by Canadians. Today, if not soon afterwards the Act was proclaimed into law, SSM was a non-issue, as non-a-issue as is whether day will follow the night. Ordinary Canadians have move on, even in the most conservative province.

    It is extraordinary that the country whose citizen sees themselves as an example to the World – in terms of their civil right, should struggle to recognize the equality of all its citizens. It is equally extraordinary that much of the world, including Canada, continues to view America as their civil rights' beacon.

    Michael, my wish for you is that open yourself to the possibility that your assumptions are ill-informed and possibly, just wrong. But in their effect, they cause real harm to loving couples and their children.

  • 185. JonT  |  November 3, 2010 at 12:52 pm

    'It is extraordinary that the country whose citizen sees themselves as an example to the World – in terms of their civil right, should struggle to recognize the equality of all its citizens.'

    Yes grod. I too have puzzled over this ever since I became old enough to start caring about things like politics and the rest of the world outside my immediate sphere of experience.

    What a disappointing realization that was. We definitely have work to do.

  • 186. Elizabeth Oakes  |  November 3, 2010 at 1:08 pm

    LOL@ a reference to King James I as some sort of historical referent for the homophobic concept of marriage espoused (as it were) by NOM and Ejercito! King James I, who succeeded to the English throne just one generation after marriage was COMPLETELY redefined in England by King Henry VIII? The guy who told the Pope to f*ck off, made himself head of his own church so he could give himself divorces whenever he wanted, and ended up marrying six women??? HA HA HA HA HA!!! Yeah, "traditional marriage" all right!!! WHOO HOO HA HA HA! That's a good one, Michael. Tell us another one of your historical jokes! That was FUNNY!!!

    This is what happens when people pretend they know the history of marriage when really they're just parroting some false factoid made up for anti-equality propaganda materials. Some of us actually know a bit about the history of marriage, Michael–you ain't one of 'em.

  • 187. Kathleen  |  November 3, 2010 at 1:25 pm

    I'm sorry to hear this Paul. I truly am. I see this as a national – even global – struggle. So hearing of this makes me sad.

    This morning so many people around me are celebrating the solid Democratic win in California. While I'm truly glad for that, it is difficult for me to feel the same sense of relief so many in my circle do because of what happened across the country.

  • 188. grod  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:19 pm

    Philip – Get a Grip!
    Your inference that being gay is a ‘disorder’, or that sexual orientation is a ‘choice’ is not accepted by informed citizens or knowledgably professionals. Attributing the questionable tearing apart of one's country's social fabric or its destruction to fellow citizen seeking equality and who comprise less that 5% is surely an exaggeration but is insulting. In your belief system how do these assertions fit with Americian's belief in "Equality for all"?

    At 7:40 pm this evening, I wrote above in this blog
    "…let me tell you about Canada. Except for Quebec, our legal system is rooted in the same traditions as is yours. We share the same or similar life styles and religious traditions. In a sense, Canadians are a mirror to yourselves.
    Between 2003 and 2005 courts in 8/10 provinces (including Quebec) and 1/3 territories found in favour of SSM. In 2005, via legislation approved in the federal houses of parliament, SSM was extended everywhere.
    At base, the same concerns expressed by you and others (i.e NOM), were expressed by Canadians. Today, if not soon afterwards the Act was proclaimed into law, SSM was a non-issue, as non-a-issue as is whether day will follow the night. Ordinary Canadians have move on, even in the most conservative province.
    It is extraordinary that the country whose citizen sees themselves as an example to the World – in terms of their civil right, should struggle to recognize the equality of all its citizens… "
    Philip, the above comments, addressed to Michael, can equally be addressed to you. I concluded in my earlier entry: "My wish for you is that open yourself to the possibility that your assumptions are ill-informed and possibly, just wrong. But in their effect, they cause real harm to loving couples and their children." I wish the same for you but would add ‘get a grip’.

  • 189. grod  |  November 3, 2010 at 2:32 pm

    @Wade
    Great idea!!. Would you happen to know their email addresses. Someone in Iowa, please help. G.

  • 190. Ed-M  |  November 3, 2010 at 3:18 pm

    Michelle, what happened last evening in California could be a harbinger of things to come… IIANM, Kamala Harris will be the next AG. In the meantime it'll be about ten years of ugliness… and maybe SCOTUS will strike down DOMA, DADT and Prop 8 for good… assuming Kagan is reliable for our side… <:-) hopeful

  • 191. Ed-M  |  November 3, 2010 at 3:28 pm

    I believe our country is being destroyed by this gay movement, our social fabric is being torn apart.

    Sounds like fear to me.

    I abhor your claims…

    Sounds like hate to me.

    But do get educated. A trip to Mass., CT, NH, VT, IA, DC and Canada will show you otherwise re: the social fabric. And you don't have to leave North America!

  • 192. Ed-M  |  November 3, 2010 at 3:37 pm

    You were right to go way over the top. Sometimes it's justified!

  • 193. Ed-M  |  November 3, 2010 at 3:45 pm

    Not only beyond contempt, it was beyind the pale!

  • 194. Ed-M  |  November 3, 2010 at 3:55 pm

    …equal protection can only be defined by the standards of each generation.

    And the justices did exactly that. It's a pity the people who voted to turf three justices out went by the standards of the generation that taught them when they were growing up…

    [youtube =http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A5VNe9NTOxA&fs=1&hl=en_US]

  • 195. Ed-M  |  November 3, 2010 at 4:09 pm

    Marriage IS a civil union! Why create another type when it's so much easier for all involved — and in keeping with the principles of limited government — to expand the type that already exists?

  • 196. JonT  |  November 3, 2010 at 5:44 pm

    Religion Ed. That's why.

  • 197. Evelyn J. Brooks  |  November 3, 2010 at 11:12 pm

    Ideally we could make use of the public's natural fear instincts to inspire public apprehension against organizations like NOM over their tactics alone. However at this point I don't think this is a very sustainable long term strategy. Public opinion is already changing. That isn't the problem. The problem comes from the fact that NOM has a LOT more money and political resources than we do. The issue is already on the court level, we've made powerful testimonies and the judges have made powerful decisions. That's already a massive punch, and at this point, that's all we can do.

    Don't get the wrong idea, NOM is trying to compensate for their lack of substance in their rhetoric and massive losses in the courts. They know that it's very likely that they'll lose SCOTUS if substance was the only card in their deck. Things look bad now but don't believe the hype, this is a desperate move for NOM.

  • 198. Bob  |  November 3, 2010 at 11:19 pm

    @Anonygrl "Lying down in the mud is not taking the low road" you got it. arriving in Scotland whole and complete is the goal, even if we are broken on the journey..

    The person on the high road often looses themselves totally, in the journey, they arrive but in body only , their soul or spirit given away to pay the price for maintaining the high ground.

    I wonder when the charade will end , when will the people let go of the smoke and mirrors, and engage themselves, in the real battle for America.

    we are only a small segment of the people that are being walked over to serve the needs of the money machine and religion. All we have to do is wake up and realize we already are in the mud. but as you say we are noble, and that defies every act of oppression, and in the end is what will stop them in their tracks,

    Nobility, honesty, and self worth, trump, deception , lying , cheating, any day.

    It would have been so much easier to vote, in such a civilized society, what will it take to wake up the masses,

    Those who are enjoying themselves too much to realize what is happening.

    In our own community many have fallen into complacency, and are satisfied with where they are. lord knows they were dancing and partying and enjoying themselves, when they could have been voting. What kind of catastrophe will it take to unite us. It's too easy to say, who cares , I never want to get married anyway, or I'm fine with hiding in the militiary, It was different with aids, because that was a threat to everyone, no one was exempt, and it rallied us as community.

  • 199. Evelyn J. Brooks  |  November 3, 2010 at 11:21 pm

    Furthermore, when it comes to peaceful protests, I personally think laying in front of their tour buses or what have you can be a waste of time if it doesn't have the complete opposite effect. The only thing these demonstrations are going to do is feed the rhetoric that they're the victims, and we're the aggressors. This kind of stuff is precisely what NOM wants us to do.

    Nom should have a right to have their bus tours and I'll fight and die for their freedom to do this. The only thing I want is for them to extend the same token of freedom to others. If they don't want to do this, then we can dispute it in court, where things will actually happen.

  • 200. Straight Ally #3008  |  November 3, 2010 at 11:22 pm

    I love Canada. Best neighbors EVAR.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=clEdy80PUMo

  • 201. Straight Ally #3008  |  November 3, 2010 at 11:25 pm

    Thanks, Ed. I realize that by invoking the Nazis I lost the argument (Godwin's Law), but sometimes you just gotta Godwin that sucka.

  • 202. Bob  |  November 3, 2010 at 11:29 pm

    @Kathleen, celebrate your win, for all of us, and remember, we already knew the win may only be California, with regard to prop8 and that's the battle that galvanized us as community, it's time after that earthquake of an election to pick ourselves up, and look around for what is still standing, thank God for prop8, it still has all the potential it always did.

    Once again California survives god hasn't punished the gayz.
    woot woot to prop8 and all the people of California

  • 203. Bob  |  November 3, 2010 at 11:54 pm

    Evelyn, I don't understand why you would fight and die for NOM's freedom , I would prefer fighting and dying for my own. leave NOM out of the equation totally, the end result will be the same, my freedom is NOM's and what they aren't able to see is that their very actions keep them in chains and their freedom on hold, cause as all their energy is channeled into oppression, that is not freedom. as the oppressed we are the ones who can lay down and stop the bus, in such a wa that will offer the oppressors true freedom, which they are unaware of, go in peace, .

    I also don't understand peoples obsession about trying to figure out precisely wht NOM wants us to do. At the end of the day, we have to stand up for ourselves regardless of the way NOM spins it. We need to find our own sense of worth and freedom, and yes the courts are one way of doing that.

  • 204. Anonygrl  |  November 4, 2010 at 12:02 am

    I hope you are having a GREAT time… I would love to see Russia. Do send pics!

    :)

  • 205. Franck  |  November 4, 2010 at 12:15 am

    Ho-Hum, anyone has read the Republicans' Pledge to America, the list of things they promised to do if they gained control of Congress?

    It might be just two lines hidden in a 48-page document, but they mention a "pledge to honor families, traditional marriage, life, and the private and faith-based
    organizations that form the core of […] American values".

    How would you interpret that? Pledging to fight marriage equality, but making it discreet enough not to attract attention?

    What annoys me that "defending liberties" keeps being mentioned here and there all over the document. And the irony that such a heavily illustrated documents mainly sports photos of white men. Defending the liberties of white, Christian, heterosexual men, then?

    – Franck P. Rabeson
    Days spent apart from my fiancé because of DOMA: 1231 days, as of today.

  • 206. Anonygrl  |  November 4, 2010 at 12:27 am

    I have no desire to get married, Bob. I never have. I am not ruling out the possibility that I might meet someone, someday, and decide to get married, but at 45 it seems that I am pretty happy with my life as is, and am not expecting marriage to happen.

    That doesn't matter to me, in this fight. MY point in fighting for equality is that equality itself matters. It matters to me that Robb who does my hair gets to marry his fiance, a lovely man I've only met once. It bothers me that Richard who is on the board of Feed Equality with me has to travel hundreds and hundreds of miles to get married, and that when he gets home, it won't be recognized. It hurts me when I see people I don't know standing on the court steps in California, holding hands and hoping that today will finally be the day that they can join the rest of the world in the institution of marriage, then leaving in tears when it turns out not to be.

    Marriage equality in California holds absolutely no tangible benefits for me. I live on the other side of the country, I wouldn't go all the way to California to get married even if I did want to marry, I have never even BEEN to California.

    But people in California (and Utah, and Michigan, and Arkansas…) are people, just like I am. And THAT makes it worth fighting for. We live in an increasingly global society, and anyone who is in it just for themselves or their little click is really no longer deserving of a seat at the adults table. Hard as it may seem to for some accept all the different peoples of this planet, it needs to be done. As for me, I think "Different? Cool! How are you different, what can you teach me?"

    That's why I take the high road, rather than sitting by the side and watching the parade pass me by.

  • 207. Gregory in Salt Lake  |  November 4, 2010 at 1:17 am

    love to both Bob and Anonygrl! Gregory

  • 208. Gregory in Salt Lake  |  November 4, 2010 at 1:56 am

    I was dumbfounded when I listened to Mitt Romney, former Governor of MA (and probable Republican candidate for president in 2012) talk about "traditional Marriage" recently when he came to Utah to promote the Republican governor candidacy….I thought he was more educated than that….after all he was the governor of the first state that offered same-gender marriages….it was like "wow", how can he, a practicing Mormon, talk about 5000/6000 years of traditional marriage with a "straight" face?

    Thanks fiona and EO for marriage reality-check for our visitor Michael.

  • 209. Lee  |  November 4, 2010 at 2:03 am

    Attack, indeed. It's frightening, really. Things keep seeming to look up and up and up, then insanity like this happens and it's like, "Wait a minute… I thought we were gaining ground!"

  • 210. DMOON  |  November 4, 2010 at 2:05 am

    NOM do you really think threatening judges with ouster if they rule against you is a great idea?
    LOL… let them try and get a favorable ruling from a court where the justices are appointed for life.
    This little gimmick will backfire on them when they appear before another court. And maybe in the states where they are being investigated for campaign finance violations, the justices will take a little more dim notice of them.
    Yeah Brian go on and threaten another court justice. That will get them to be more favorable.

  • 211. Gregory in Salt Lake  |  November 4, 2010 at 2:23 am

    hope your predictions are not true our Dear Elizabeth Oakes….."Dark Times…"

    If gets worse, California and New York seem pretty good options of places to migrate to….or perhaps Canada. Waiting and watching with alertness…

    p.s. I appreciate and look forward to every post you make : )

  • 212. Ronnie  |  November 4, 2010 at 5:34 am

    Kirsten Gillibrand…uuggg,,,I always get her name mixed…I know a lot of Kristen's & Kirsten's….& always mix their names up too…apologies…Sen. Gillibrand….<3…Ronnie

  • 213. Chris From CO  |  November 4, 2010 at 5:43 am

    I think it is time for a vigil in Iwoa to show respect for them on their last day in the court. They need to know their rulling was was right and they should be proud. They displayed the better part of humanity, and respected our constitutionial rights far better than most have done so far. : (

  • 214. Bob  |  November 4, 2010 at 9:48 am

    great idea Chris, a vigil in Iowa, for the judges, that;s a great action.

  • 215. Justin Lewis  |  November 4, 2010 at 1:41 pm

    We should pressure President Obama to appoint these fine judges to federal judgeships. The 8th Circuit Court of Appeals, especially.

    Now that Obama has lost the House, maybe he'll finally show some interest in judicial appointments, since they require only Senate confirmation and the House has no say.

  • 216. Michael Ejercito  |  November 5, 2010 at 3:32 am

    Which makes it all okay in your mind, right? Because saying that same-sex couples are not capable of loving each other in the same way as opposite-sex couples (which you did indeed say) could not possibly be the proverbial last straw that some young, struggling GLBT person reads on a day where he or she has been beaten up, thrown out of the house, raped, etc.

    Interesting that you mention rape. I have heard and read thay the Center for Disease Control's Youth Risk Survey shows that gay students are more than twice as likely to report having had sexual intercourse before age 13, which is sexual abuse. And they are four times as likely to report forced sexual contact.

    Would not rape and sexual abuse be a much bigger factor in suicide than some people's opinion on marriage? There are predatory nithings out there who prey on those they perceive to be more vulnerable. Should this not be stopped?

  • 217. fiona64  |  November 5, 2010 at 3:42 am

    What's far more interesting is that once again you make an assertion about something you "heard and read" without providing documentation, continue to make assertions that blame the victims of sexual abuse, and conflate being gay with being a pedophile.

    Get help.

  • 218. Ronnie  |  November 5, 2010 at 3:48 am

    Michael Ejerkcito Heeft bloed op zijn handen…. ; ) …Ronnie

  • 219. Michael Ejercito  |  November 5, 2010 at 4:37 am

    What’s far more interesting is that once again you make an assertion about something you “heard and read” without providing documentation, continue to make assertions that blame the victims of sexual abuse, and conflate being gay with being a pedophile.

    Where have I blamed victims of sexual abuse. I cited the CDC's Youth Risdk Survey, showing that gay teens are more than twice as likely as straight teens to be victims of sexual abuse. If they had sexual contact before age twelve, that is rape.

  • 220. Ronnie  |  November 5, 2010 at 4:51 am

    Michael Ejerkcito is enn Homofobisch (who) Heeft bloed op zijn handen…. ; ) …Ronnie

  • 221. fiona64  |  November 5, 2010 at 6:22 am

    No, Michael. You didn't cite anything. You made a claim, but provided no citation.

    Just go a way.

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    Just to draw an unlikely example of an alternative: In Iraq the High Judicial Council, an independent body, vets and appoints potential judges. Once selected, the justices get a one-year probationary period. If they pass a comprehensive performance review at the end of that year, they can be confirmed until the mandatory retirement age of 63.

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