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Rick Santorum vs Marriage

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By Matt Baume

Rick Santorum says he’ll fight the Supreme Court on marriage. Sure he will. North Carolina passed a law allowing officials to opt-out of marrying not just gay couples, but all couples. And Texas is shaping up to be the primary battleground once the Supreme Court rules on marriage.

With the Supreme Court due to rule on marriage any day now, Presidential “candidate” Rick Santorum says he would fight back against a pro-equality ruling. He says that states allowing gay and lesbian couples to marry is a violation of his religious freedom, which is an argument a lot people made about interracial marriage in the 60s. So do couples need to worry about the possibility that Rick Santorum could stop them from marrying? No. For one thing, the president doesn’t get to veto Supreme Court rulings. And for another, Rick Santorum will never be president.

But statements like those give cover to organizations that oppose marriage equality. Last week a group of religious leaders took out an ad in some newspapers saying that they would defy any order from the Supreme Court to recognize marriage equality. Can they do that? No, not really. At most, they can use this as an excuse to gather email addresses on a petition, which is exactly what they’re doing. This is the work of Rick Scarborough, who has in the past suggested that someone should file a class action lawsuit against homosexuality, so clearly not one of the country’s great legal minds.

Meanwhile, back in reality, a judge in Arkansas ruled this week that the state must recognize marriages performed during a brief window last year when clerks were issuing licenses. And Lambda Legal has filed a new lawsuit in Texas to stop the state from denying spousal benefits to LGBT government employees. Texas is shaping up to be a battleground state when we get a marriage ruling, with some officials doing what they can to resist equality, and others, like the clerk in Dallas, eagerly awaiting the opportunity to marry queer couples.

Also last week, the North Carolina legislature passed a law that allows government officials to opt out of issuing licenses on the basis of their religion. If they opt out, they have to do so for everyone — gay or straight, they’d have to reject all couples. It’s worth pointing out that North Carolina has had marriage equality for over half a year at this point, with no problems. And a new survey shows public support for equality reaching a new high in the state.

That goes along with a new survey from Pew this week, showing support for marriage continuing to do what it’s done for the last decade and a half. Nationally, support is averaging somewhere around 57%, with opposition well under 40. And that’s the big reason why any attempt to disobey the Supreme Court will be unsuccessful. There just aren’t enough people left who oppose the freedom to marry.

43 Comments

  • 1. mu2  |  June 15, 2015 at 9:21 am

    It really is amazing that these aholes in the "christian right" (which is neither) have the idea that who someone they don't even know wants to marry is any of their goddam business. It isn't.

  • 2. All_American60  |  June 15, 2015 at 9:33 am

    "Allowing equal rights to all people, under the constitution, is a violation of my religous freedom."

    There you have what much religion, particularly christianity, teaches: judgement and hatred.

    That people like Santorum are finally exposing this, and so clearly, is a good thing.

  • 3. guitaristbl  |  June 15, 2015 at 9:38 am

    Who cares what Santorum thinks ? I have more of a chance of becoming president than him and I am not even a US citizen.

    It's all about SCOTUS and the surprising Din decision and what it says about Obergefell today imo. One certain thing is that it sets the tone of whatever Scalia writes…I think he hates gay people more than immigrants so I expect even more venomous language there.

  • 4. Christian0811  |  June 15, 2015 at 9:57 am

    Amen sister

  • 5. Mike_Baltimore  |  June 15, 2015 at 10:04 am

    Off topic:

    'In three weeks, being gay won't be a crime anymore in Mozambique' is a headline in the 'Global Post'. (Actually, it's two weeks from today [June 15], and when this article was published [June 12], it was two weeks and three days.)
    ( http://www.globalpost.com/article/6580084/2015/06… )

  • 6. RnL2008  |  June 15, 2015 at 11:53 am

    "He says that states allowing gay and lesbian couples to marry is a violation of his religious freedom", I want to know how my marriage or the marriages of other Same-Sex couples VIOLATE his religious freedom? I want to know HOW the right to marry the person of one's choosing WITHOUT a specific gender requirement VIOLATES his religious freedom? And finally, this AZZWIPE is VIOLATING my personal and religious freedom simply for BREATHING the same air I do……where do I start my lawsuit against him for that?

  • 7. alleninsb  |  June 15, 2015 at 12:31 pm

    You have somehow managed to make me defend Santorum which I would have thought was impossible.

    Criticizing someone about the way that they choose to grieve over the loss of their new born baby is flat out shameful.

  • 8. alleninsb  |  June 15, 2015 at 1:05 pm

    Do you not see the irony in that post?

  • 9. Mike_Baltimore  |  June 15, 2015 at 1:33 pm

    So you wouldn't criticize someone who steals another newborn because they had a stillborn baby? After all, they are stealing the newborn as their method of grieving. I wouldn't condone it, but you wouldn't even criticize it?

    Maybe shooting up the room at the hospital where they keep newborns. After all, that might be the way they grieve ['If I can't have my newborn, no one can'}. They wouldn't deserve criticism? I wouldn't condone it, but you wouldn't even criticize it?

    Grieving in a human manner is one thing – criticizing them is also human nature. Holding, cradling, etc., a stillborn newborn is NOT normal human nature, especially for anyone not the mother.

  • 10. jm64tx  |  June 15, 2015 at 1:43 pm

    "Holding, cradling, etc., a stillborn newborn is NOT normal human nature, especially for anyone not the mother."

    All of the mental health world disagrees with you.

    "Stillbirth is recognized as one of the most traumatic experiences a parent can go through and may be associated with long-lasting psychosocial effects. Additionally, parents may have had limited or no previous experience with death. They are typically fearful and confused about what to expect andwhat options are available to them."

    "Seeing and holding a live baby after birth is a normal parental response. Seeing and holding a stillborn baby is also a normal response, and there is much evidence that doing so can be a valuable and cherished experience. "
    http://missfoundation.org/news/StillbirthContactw

  • 11. RemC  |  June 15, 2015 at 1:44 pm

    May I strongly suggest that we just ignore jm64tx's latest? Don't engage, don't comment, just ignore. It is not worthy of any response at all. We can talk among ourselves, but let's see what happens if no one hits the "reply" button.

  • 12. jm64tx  |  June 15, 2015 at 1:50 pm

    Well since I've actually had a stillborn child (where I was the father and married to the mother) and know the intense emotional grief that comes with that… I'm speaking from experience. You obviously are not.

    Nonetheless Ive deleted the comment since after re-reading it I was probably being too harsh.

  • 13. mu2  |  June 15, 2015 at 2:14 pm

    Since about one third of fertilized human eggs die and get flushed down the crapper without any human intervention, your dirty fukking 'god' appears to be the world champion abortionist.

  • 14. mu2  |  June 15, 2015 at 2:17 pm

    Well, according to Pat ROBert$on, that kid could very well have grown up to be another Hitler. Just like you. So it turned out fine.

  • 15. mu2  |  June 15, 2015 at 2:22 pm

    Richard Dawkins distilled the attributes of the god of the Old Testament succinctly:

    "[it] is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it, a petty, unjust, unforgiving control freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic capriciously malevolent bully."

    That is no joke, any scholar of the Old Testament will immediately recognize these characteristics in the first three chapters.

    It's a peculiar insanity of our species that some of us think it's a good idea to acknowledge or even worship such a monster.

    Those who are inclined to believe in absurdities such as imaginary gods can easily be persuaded to commit atrocities…a pretty accurate evaluation of most contemporary American "christians".

  • 16. alleninsb  |  June 15, 2015 at 2:26 pm

    Of course kidnapping and murdering a room full of newborns is exactly the same as grieving in a weird way. What the fuck is wrong with you?

  • 17. Mike_Baltimore  |  June 15, 2015 at 2:42 pm

    But you wouldn't even criticize doing the grieving in weird ways?

    And didn't I already say that I don't condone grieving in such weird ways, but I guess you didn't read that.

  • 18. bayareajohn  |  June 15, 2015 at 2:47 pm

    What's harder for many to understand is why a people would invent such a harsh god and then vow to subjugate themselves and pray to such a god.

    Comparative belief studies give a clue across cultures: by erecting an external and supernatural "cause" for suffering and disaster and loss as well as health and winning, societies channel their helplessness and refute the meaninglessness of their individual lives. If events are random (and largely bad), life and progress are pointless and meaningless. If instead they are punishment and reward, and supplication for mercy stands a chance of helping, life and morality have a basis for growth. As well as a new way to define "us" vs "them", placing blame, and starting wars ("crusades").

    Plus, belief systems provide the opportunity for hierarchical control over society for self-appointed leaders who need not produce results in order to remain in office.

    It is a peculiar insanity, historically resulting in both societal growth and strife… again and again and again. For both good and bad (and a lot of both), civilization would quite literally not be where it is today without religion.

    May it now be moving toward fairness on the whole.

  • 19. bayareajohn  |  June 15, 2015 at 2:55 pm

    In exactly the same way that families gather to see and touch and weep over the body of a passed loved one. Witnessing the dead body, embracing the reality of the passing, has always been more than a tradition. It helps the mind and emotions to get closure and move on. Entirely human nature. And healthy. Root word there: HEAL.

  • 20. alleninsb  |  June 15, 2015 at 3:15 pm

    No, I wouldn't criticize grieving in weird ways because criticizing someone's lifestyle choice that causes no harm to others is abhorrent. I'll leave that to you and to Santorum.

  • 21. mu2  |  June 15, 2015 at 3:23 pm

    Looks like a few pearl clutchers don't like the FACT I posted. What a bunch of chickenshits.

  • 22. Mike_Baltimore  |  June 15, 2015 at 3:31 pm

    But you wouldn't even criticize grieving in what a person considers weird ways.

    (No longer a question, now a statement, as you have commented that ANY type of grieving should not be criticized.)

  • 23. DJSNOLA  |  June 15, 2015 at 3:49 pm

    People in power love an all powerful , infallible god because it gives them absolute control over others.

  • 24. DJSNOLA  |  June 15, 2015 at 3:50 pm

    Interesting, I agree. Im leaning more towards a 6-3 decision now than I have been.

  • 25. DJSNOLA  |  June 15, 2015 at 3:51 pm

    Thats awesome to see progress in Africa like that.

  • 26. gay_avenger  |  June 15, 2015 at 3:54 pm

    tough words coming from an anonymous old bag of wind your gutter mouth insults to people are just as "cs"

  • 27. DJSNOLA  |  June 15, 2015 at 3:54 pm

    Ok lets get back on topic here. Rick is looking for attention with his outlandish gay bashing. Lets not discuss him anymore since he really is irrelevant.

  • 28. gay_avenger  |  June 15, 2015 at 3:56 pm

    well stated

  • 29. alleninsb  |  June 15, 2015 at 4:54 pm

    You are something else, dude. False equivalencies, excluding the middle and numerous other disgusting debate techniques. It's disappointing when people fighting for tolerance can't manage any of their own. This is why I couldn't hang out with so many liberal activists in my college days even though I agreed with the cause.

  • 30. mu2  |  June 15, 2015 at 5:22 pm

    I was fighting for gay rights when you were still a gleam in the milkman's eye, fuckwit. As if YOU aren't anonymous, shitforbrains. If it weren't for guys like me you would still be thrown in jail just for being a cocksucker. Maybe you can get your flaccid dogshit god to smite me. Bring it on, asshole. If you don't like what I write, ignore it…I've listened to assholes condemn me to hell for being who I am for 65 years, one more doesn't bother me one fucking bit.

  • 31. RobW303  |  June 15, 2015 at 5:25 pm

    "[…] self-appointed leaders who need not produce results in order to remain in office"

    Pretty much describes Congress. We're just given the illusion of choice at the ballot box.

  • 32. bayareajohn  |  June 15, 2015 at 5:45 pm

    Maybe the -way- you've spent your life fighting has helped bigots presume we are all assholes.

  • 33. bayareajohn  |  June 15, 2015 at 5:53 pm

    Agreed, there there is little difference between religion and politics. Especially as you move to the right… the difference vanishes altogether and they become one.

  • 34. ianbirmingham  |  June 15, 2015 at 6:02 pm

    A reminder (which seems highly appropriate for this thread):

    In order to maintain an informative and valuable service that meets the needs of the users of EqualityOnTrial.com and avoids the harm that can result from disseminating statements that are false, malicious, violate the rights of others, or otherwise harmful, it is necessary to establish the following Community Guidelines to protect against abuse: …

    7. You may not post or transmit any message which is harmful, threatening, abusive, hateful, or defamatory (defamatory anti-lesbian, anti-gay, anti-bisexual, and anti-transgender language will include, but not be limited to, the language identified as defamatory within the current online version of the GLAAD Media Guide). Excessive use of profanity is discouraged and epithets directed at community members are grounds for suspension or deactivation (banning) at any time. These rules go for both sides of a discussion and apply fairly to each side whether or not you agree with the views espoused by fellow commenters, EqualityOnTrial.com moderators or the views of the Courage Campaign Institute. In other words, just because most people in the comments agrees with you doesn’t give you the right to call a fellow commenter names, tell him/her to go to hell, etc. This further inflames flame wars and is not acceptable.

    http://www.equalityontrial.com/about/

  • 35. Eric  |  June 15, 2015 at 6:59 pm

    No one needed to do anything for bigots to arrive at their conclusions. Such is the nature of bigotry.

  • 36. VIRick  |  June 15, 2015 at 8:04 pm

    Thanks Ian.

    I would further urge all commentators who, up to this point, have unleashed unneeded profanity and assorted wanton epithets to hit the "Delete" button, which can be found in the lower right hand corner of their comment. As of the moment, none of the heated comments any longer make any sense, as apparently, several of the comments (perhaps including those which helped launch this firestorm) have already been removed. There's no longer any continuity,– just a string of profanity and epithets, more-than-adequate grounds for the suspension of several users' accounts.

  • 37. RnL2008  |  June 15, 2015 at 8:16 pm

    I removed my comments and though I will continue to read the information here, I doubt I will respond much unless I personally know the commentator and that person knows me.

    Have a great evening Rick

  • 38. VIRick  |  June 15, 2015 at 8:30 pm

    Rose, I never saw what you wrote (and deleted), but you're apparently not the only person here who has already deleted something. However, I can't quite tell.

    My urging to delete was not directed toward you, but rather, toward the others who attacked each other with profanity and epithets, missives which are still visible, but which are now unhinged (assuming they were ever actually hinged in the first instance), as the context is gone.

    Personally, I've spent a lot of time and energy here at EoT providing positive, upbeat, progressive LGBT news, and am affronted by the cheap worthlessness of many of the remaining comments in this thread, none of which is useful or enlightening. Thus, I've now stopped commenting here.

  • 39. RnL2008  |  June 15, 2015 at 8:35 pm

    Well, I have to agree with you and my comment that I deleted was my opinion regarding something I felt was just not appropriate about what Santorum and his wife did……I offended someone with my comment NOT aware of their own past, but regardless of why I feel the way I do about it, several opted to make me out to be a heartless person and ya know what, I'm NOT.

    I come here for news, a way to connect with others who believe as I do and because there aren't a lot of trolls who attack, but today it appeared that instead of just disagreeing with me, it was much easier to attack my character and that I DON'T need.

    You know how to reach me my friend and yes, I do consider you a good person and a friend.

  • 40. VIRick  |  June 15, 2015 at 8:45 pm

    Oh Rose, there's no need to apologize to me, as you're too sweet and too kind.

    As far as Rick Santorum is concerned, I never read/listen to anything he ever says. Dan Savage has a valid point in referring to him as "Frothy Mix," as did the voters of Pennsylvania when they refused to re-elect him some years ago, even before he became completely ridiculous. He hasn't held job since.

    In any case, I'm still waiting for the other commentators to clean up their acts.

  • 41. RnL2008  |  June 15, 2015 at 8:49 pm

    Well, I can't do anything about the others, only myself and some would disagree with your opinions regarding me…..but life will go on and hopefully we know the ruling here soon.

    Hugs

  • 42. SethInMaryland  |  June 15, 2015 at 8:57 pm

    congrats to the Oneida Nation of Wisconsin, marriage equality took effect 2 days ago in the tribal nation , this brings the number of tribal nations to 24

  • 43. VIRick  |  June 16, 2015 at 1:04 pm

    NSFW warning

    Careful: New readers be advised that certain comments further along in this thread are distinctly NSFW, as one guilty party, in particular, has refused to abide by the rules here at EoT, and said comments, even 24 hours later, are still visible!! They ought to be deleted (as they no longer refer to anything), but haven't been.

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